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Bugs, bugs, bugs > HUGE flaw in end of game coaching logic

HUGE flaw in end of game coaching logic

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This Post:
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268972.1
Date: 4/22/2015 10:25:03 AM
Greensboro Generals
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
746746
If this has been discuss elsewhere my apologies.

My co worker got jammed HARD at the end of his relegation contest, At 52m 50s he hit a three to cut a 4pt lead to one, then DID NOT FOUL, which someone with even a cursory knowledge of the sport knows is what you do in that situation to extend the game.

http://www.buzzerbeater.com/match/82018517/boxscore.aspx

(82018517)


What I would like to see is the ability to better control how you want end of game situations to play out. Has there ever been any investigation of adding the ability to custom program end of game orders? If not I think it would make a helluva idea. As it is the default is for fouls to occur if it is a 2pt to 12pt game in the final minute, but every game is different and end of game decisions are based upon what you expect from that opponent, see NC State's 1983 title run for a fine example.






Last edited by Coach Lambini at 4/22/2015 10:25:36 AM

This Post:
00
268972.2 in reply to 268972.1
Date: 4/22/2015 2:01:07 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
9292
One of the issues that I have seen a lot of times with the game engine is on some plays where there are turnovers, the play will go on for well longer than the 24 second shot clock, or, if time is low, until the quarter hits exactly 0:00.

Don't know whether to attribute it to bug or not but many times it is completely illogical, looking at your play for example. Wish it could be addressed; it's not basketball we're simulating; it's chess (sadly).

Hopefully you can bounce back from this in seasons to come, it always sucks to lose games like this I myself have had a fair share of missed layup buzzerbeaters, comebacks cut short, etc.

This Post:
00
268972.3 in reply to 268972.1
Date: 4/23/2015 5:26:23 AM
TrenseRI
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
36003600
Second Team:
ChiLeaders
That is indeed a bug, a known bug, and very hard one to fix which has been around for a long time. It is the same one Neway mentioned; sometimes, the shot clock runs longer than 24 seconds and ends up in a steal. Your co worker had the bad luck to have it happen to him at the worst moment possible. I will try to fix it but I cannot alter the games that had already been played.

This Post:
00
268972.4 in reply to 268972.3
Date: 4/23/2015 9:42:16 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
That is indeed a bug, a known bug, and very hard one to fix which has been around for a long time. It is the same one Neway mentioned; sometimes, the shot clock runs longer than 24 seconds and ends up in a steal. Your co worker had the bad luck to have it happen to him at the worst moment possible. I will try to fix it but I cannot alter the games that had already been played.


Yeah, it's as if the game calculates a steal is going to occur and if it does, it just waits for that to happen, and the timing issues related to the shot clock / end of game logic seem to just miss. Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like it's as easy as putting in an additional bit of logic to cut off the possession at 24 seconds to trigger the steal or short-circuiting it earlier for end of game situations to force the steal or a foul. I presume it has something to do with the design of the engine not necessarily being a second-by-second evaluation of where the ball is and all of that, but instead a calculation of the end result of the possession that doesn't necessarily understand that an assisted layup after a defensive rebound with one second left is not feasible.

This Post:
00
268972.5 in reply to 268972.4
Date: 4/23/2015 10:51:04 AM
Greensboro Generals
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
746746
Of course what is done is done...and not like it is really THAT big of a deal, but it would be nice to see if there is a way that can be corrected, easiest thing I think would be just to change the general orders to FOUL if down PERIOD in the final minute, though I feel as stated before the addition of 'winning time' orders would be a really cool feature to investigate the feasibility of.

This Post:
00
268972.6 in reply to 268972.5
Date: 4/23/2015 11:55:13 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
Of course what is done is done...and not like it is really THAT big of a deal, but it would be nice to see if there is a way that can be corrected, easiest thing I think would be just to change the general orders to FOUL if down PERIOD in the final minute, though I feel as stated before the addition of 'winning time' orders would be a really cool feature to investigate the feasibility of.


I think the intent is to do the "try for a steal on the inbounds pass / defensive rebound and then foul" mentality, just that in this case the engine just checks to see if a steal is calculated and doesn't have the additional information that it may be 40 seconds later.

This Post:
00
268972.7 in reply to 268972.6
Date: 4/23/2015 1:27:54 PM
Greensboro Generals
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
746746
Oh yeah, 40 seconds to go, down 1 2 or 3 in real life you would play out the shot clock and see what happens.....