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I've seen just now the ratings of the BBB match between Abrantes and Magicos and I'm really surprised about the final result. One reason of the defeat of Abrantes can be the number of fouls so I checked the 3 players with 6 fouls to see if they are affected by the hidden skill but all of them have an average foul very low (max 2,2/game). I've discovered yesterday about a bug in my outside defence could be a bug in the ratings also in this match? Abrantes had the best defence (2-3) and a big gap in the ratings. Another point that is completely wrong (imho) is the rating referred to the rebounds, almost 2 lvl of difference and Abrantes has taken less rebound, how it is possible?

A new season will start in a few weeks, I'd like to see a "logical" in the rebounds and also I think that BBs should give more importance to some skills like passages for example; I've seen the market, there are lvl 12 that making less assists than my lvl 7, also shot blocking is a skill that is not useful. Thanks for your time

because fouls are really low N events, I don't think something went wrong in this match to cause more fouls... i think it just happened randomly... this happens sometimes in real games... players who dont usually get a lot of fouls get a lot of fouls.

what is the bug in the outside defense you are speaking of?

rebounding I think needs to be rebalanced, I think it worked well for low rebounding skills but the algorithm we are using makes the relative advantage of 1 point difference in rebounding diminish as rebounding skill gets higher. I would like to retune this so that a difference of 1 level gives a fixed advantage across the entire spectrum.... there are similar retunings that probably need to be done across the GE... I am hoping we will do this at the start of next season, but we haven't had a full internal debate about it, and it would be a major retuning project and so we would be concerned about changing the game balance too rapidly.

shot blocking is a useful skill...maybe we should make it more important and make it a part of determining inside shots.

how many assists your level 12 makes is both of function of his level and the competition he is playing against, and the level of passing of his teammates.

EDIT: SOME OF THESE STATEMENTS MIGHT BE MISLEADING.. PLEASE READ (66639.86)

Last edited by BB-Forrest at 1/7/2009 9:47:13 PM

what is the bug in the outside defense you are speaking of?

Although I'm not sure wether ned is talking about this bug, there is something wrong with the OD rating for about 3 seasons now already, but we've never really found what it is. My latest guess is that there's something wrong with the contribution of the SG to the OD rating.

The 1st post about this issue actually was at 4/14/2008 and I can refer you to this thread; (24361.1)
I believe it was never solved. The last BB post in that thread came from BB-Charles saying this;

I am still unable to find this in the code, although the results you're giving me seem to suggest pretty strongly that it's there.

So, here's another possibility to consider. When a player is in foul trouble, their defense will be weaker while they're on the court. For outside players, this manifests itself in an unwillingness to challenge the ball handler or to really get in their face on jumpers, and will weaken outside defense somewhat as long as your player is trying to play through his foul trouble. I notice that eventually the starting SG fouled out in the first game posted in this thread, and wonder whether that might be part of the answer.

I'm going to have to keep looking at this one, because I really don't know the correct answer here.

I guess it's just one of the BB mystery's. I can give you a few recent (this season) examples where the OD ratings is odd if you like.

Oh btw, thnx for the nice post hehe.

Last edited by BB-Patrick at 1/1/2009 12:04:44 PM

First point, ok, thanks ;)

Second, I'll speak with Domenico ;)

Regarding rebound, you'll give us a favour, some ratings against rebounds taken are "strange".

About shot blocking I'm sorry I don't agree, 1 or 2 shot blocking per match cannot change anything in a game and further to this it seems to me that an high level skill shot blocking doesn't guarantee a "lot" of shot blocking. More or less is the same that assist, I'm playing in Italy first division and I've some players that give more assists than a lvl 12 or 13 in IV division USA when I've skill lvl 7 or 8, this is quite strange too

Of course BB is the best online game I play and these are only some "details", the big problems are almost solved (like day trading for example), but if you can make BB the perfect game, why not?

EDIT: SOME OF THESE STATEMENTS MIGHT BE MISLEADING.. PLEASE READ (66639.86)

Last edited by BB-Forrest at 1/7/2009 9:47:49 PM

Regarding a potential GE adjustment/rebalancing, maybe need to take a peek at the home court advantage, seems to have become more difficult over the seasons for any team to win away.

I second that, the HCA seems higher this season.

I can say that I am continuing amazed at the ability of our users to detect bugs with disturbing accuracy. There was indeed a bug in the GE with respect to how OD team ratings were presented, that had to do with the SG OD contribution... (his jumpshot was being added to the rating and not the OD). Now before everyone freaks out and demands their games rerun, this is simply a presentational error.. as teamratings are not the things we principly use when calculating results for things in the GE.

I fixed it on Tuesday, so things should be presented better going forward.

perhaps this is the OD error ned is winking about...

i do not believe we have changed the numerical size of the HCA, however, perhaps because it is a multiplicative effect it is having a larger effect with larger ratings...

this again gets at the core question of revisiting how all of our calculations scale within the GE. There are many areas that are probably not scaling as we would like them to. The problem is that reworking the formulas to scale better is going to involve a massive retuning of the GE and there is no guarantee that the competitive balance won't be thrown off.... meaning what was a good team in the old GE might be significantly worse in the new, and vice versa.... given that users have spent a lot of time and effort tuning their teams to the current game balance it is a challenge to figure out how to retune things without pissing everyone off.

EDIT: SOME OF THESE STATEMENTS MIGHT BE MISLEADING.. PLEASE READ (66639.86)

Last edited by BB-Forrest at 1/7/2009 9:48:19 PM

perhaps this is the OD error ned is winking about...

This is correct. Good to know it's only presentational.

Last edited by GM-kozlodoev at 1/1/2009 2:27:27 PM

I think a lot of us were under the wrong impression that the changes to the GE were rolled out to the official league games and not only for the scrimmages. And my personal impression was exactly what you're describing, the competitive balance beeing thrown off, I felt my team was worse only because of those changes. I guess I'm not one of those players you're talking that will acurately "feel" the bugs

sorry let me clarify, i thought i did earlier... the changes were first rolled out to scrimmages, and then later were implemented for all games.... i was mistaken before when i suggested they hadn't. sorry for the confusion.

so that being said anyone have any bright ideas how to handle the conundrum?

either dont change anything and deal with issues like rebounding advantages not scalling as rebounding ratings get higher? or changing the way we do rebounding and potentially changing the competitive balance.. particularly for the higher leagues.

EDIT: SOME OF THESE STATEMENTS MIGHT BE MISLEADING.. PLEASE READ (66639.86)

Last edited by BB-Forrest at 1/7/2009 9:48:43 PM