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I havent bought a player in a last minute hurry, I counter your many, raise you with most users do not buy players for one game.

You gotta give this up fella. Teams with ambition are doing this all around you every week... BB3/domestic cup and soon some managers who know their roster isnt strong enough to secure them promotion or a championship will contemplate if and who they splurge on in order to improve their chances. I'm not saying its right but its a strategy and one day maybe you will or should consider it for your own team. You can't tell me you'll never get a key injury 1 week before the playoffs or a cup game and that will cause you to pay over what you would normally deem appropriate for a replacement.

Just use the transfer market in the manner it has been set out for everyone to utilize. It's regulated nicely by the community of managers and the GM's when called into action make the ultimate decisions as to whether anything untoward has taken place.

After all has been said and discussed in this thread maybe rather than considering why with all your experience 'you wouldnt pay X' instead think of 'why should you pay Y' (or accept the counter arguments you love to ignore on why there are plausible reasons for player valuations higher than you may agree with.) We all see players transfer for prices over and above what we ourselves would pay. What I think you are misunderstanding is that its not just new teams that pay prices that you cant figure out why. (related to 1st paragraph)

Your concern about perennial listers can be construed as an annoyance but there are sufficient preventative measures in place and beady eyes to ensure this activity is punished.

Lets move on.


Last edited by Superfly Guy at 5/8/2010 12:30:58 AM

I havent bought a player in a last minute hurry, I counter your many, raise you with most users do not buy players for one game.

I think you severely underestimate how often this happens. I know teams that want to do well in the cup that have bought players in a rush to try and secure a victory. More commonly is the last minute rush before playoffs where many people are trying to get a last minute superstar to increase their chances of promotion, or simply to avoid relegation. Hence why prices are often so much higher during the week before playoffs.

Which is good because the constant listers can list once a week

So what you are saying here is you don't mind people constantly listing "overpriced" players as long as it is only once a week? If listed players couldn't play then even managers who are listing at a small starting price will start listing him on tuesday after the league game so that the player (if not sold) will be available for the next game. This will give an unfair advantage to managers that are available on friday nights to buy players, or more importantly, it will disadvantage managers that aren't able to be on BB on friday nights. The TL isn't supposed to be like that, there should be players of quality standard available all day every day for whoever wishes to purchase them.

You seem to keep referring to newbies as if they are the only ones that have overpaid for a player. I don't consider myself a newbie (although you may consider me one) and I have overpaid for players. I overpay because if there is a particular player that I want to buy then I will buy him and I don't mind overpaying for him. It may be that he is an Australian player with good skills and would drastically improve my team, in which case he is worth more to me then it would be worth to you. So does that mean I am overpaying? I don't think so, I am paying what I think the player is worth, just because it is more than you think it is worth doesn't mean I am overpaying.

Like you said lets consider a more plausible example than 15 million. So with your example of 150k, perhaps the player is a 2k player with Hall of Famer potential. Does that now mean he is worth 150k? What if an experienced player buys the 2k salary player with Hall of Famer potential? Does that now mean that he is worth 150k?

All I am trying to say is that there are 50000 users (approximately) in this game. If I list my player at a particular price, there only needs to be 1 player that thinks the value of the player is the same or close to what I listed. I am not talking about tricking a newbie in to buying an overpriced player. I am talking about listing a 1 million dollar player for 1.2 million because he has a slightly unique skill set. Now maybe he doesn't sell for a week or 2, and then on the third week suddenly 2 players bid on the player and eventually he sells for 1.5 million. Market forces are highly unstable and unpredictable and values of players can change every day.

Once there is a free market, it means that you can do things which can get you in a better situation. Completely fair system means that there should be solid prices for every skill and noone should earn more than that...

However trying to regulate free market is the decision which is going against the existence itself, because try to ask yourself - why should be there any free market, if there will work things by the principles which are not free?

I think you severely underestimate how often this happens. I know teams that want to do well in the cup that have bought players in a rush to try and secure a victory. More commonly is the last minute rush before playoffs where many people are trying to get a last minute superstar to increase their chances of promotion, or simply to avoid relegation. Hence why prices are often so much higher during the week before playoffs.

I know prices change before the playoff, but most of the managers buy players to keep, not like Superfly who constantly changes his lineup. Great team has better chance at selling high aswell, why? because people tend to think he must have superb players, not all of those players are great, we could almost call it daytrading. How would player tax interfere with people buying higher. It would just tax players not sold.

So what you are saying here is you don't mind people constantly listing "overpriced" players as long as it is only once a week?

I'm not saying that removing players from active list during TL time is the best idea, but it would "help" with the constant listing problem. I still think taxing not sold players is the best way.
Ofcourse there are different users and different needs, but you need to get this: there is a certain player value, nomatter what you think the player might be worth. If a player is valued about 1,2-2mil for example you think he is worth 4mil to you because he is australian. Now there is no TPE for him. He is listed at 1,5 at the start, now some players have bid on him and he is at 1,8mil, will you go and bid 4mil for him from the start or is he really worth 4mil? Now if he is listed at 4mil and you go and bid on him alone, it does not show he is worth 4mil, it shows you have no idea what you are doing. Players skills determine the value. If you overbid on something, it needs to be noticed and transfer price fixed. You will lose your 4mil (for bad management) but the sellers received money needs to be adjusted to prevent cheating.

I think the fundamental argument here is on how a players value is defined. If 1 person thinks a player is worth 1 million then is it? What about if 5 people think that? What about 50?

I am talking about listing a 1 million dollar player for 1.2 million because he has a slightly unique skill set. Now maybe he doesn't sell for a week or 2, and then on the third week suddenly 2 players bid on the player and eventually he sells for 1.5 million. Market forces are highly unstable and unpredictable and values of players can change every day.

Now let's say you do not sell him for 2 times he has been on TL and will sell him at the third time with pricetag 1,5mil. You have payed 24k in taxes + transfer tax ofcourse. It really does not hurt you, BUT if you keep him listed at 1,2 mil 10 times and he does not sell?

Like you said lets consider a more plausible example than 15 million. So with your example of 150k, perhaps the player is a 2k player with Hall of Famer potential. Does that now mean he is worth 150k? What if an experienced player buys the 2k salary player with Hall of Famer potential? Does that now mean that he is worth 150k?

How old is the player? What if he is 26 years old? Is he worth 150k? Biggest mistakes on the TL are made when just looking at the potential. Buying players that can not reach their potential due to their age etc.

I think the formula consists of players quality (what better players or weaker players are worth), age, potential. Ofcourse recent sales and amount of similar players in the game or on the market also play a role. I believe BB-s have somekind of player valueing system or else they would not be able to evaluate player salarys during off season etc.

Completely fair system means that there should be solid prices for every skill and noone should earn more than that...

Every player has a price range depending on the selling time and need for those players. The price is not fixed. I'm not trying to fixate prices, just trying to tax people who tend to list all their players high just for the purpose of fishing users on bidding players not actually worth that much.

I know what you are trying to do. All I want is to find any reason why it should be like that.

The point that prices would be more settlet pretty much unrelate with the principle of transfer market, because why should be things so complicated that every manager would be forced to behave on the transfer market, while should be every starting price based in fact on his decision? It doesnt make any sense... and seems more like an illusion of a "free" about you have to decide on yourself what you will do. Thats why it seems to me more reasonable to change this system itself than create from it overregulated illusion of something what used to be a market...

The game is about making decisions and while I dont quite like to see that some clubs are earning most of their money on the market, understanding of such a system should be (imo) based on the decisions which give opportunity to unexperienced managers go and fail sometimes - or just never fail at all.

(sorry for that wicked form, Im not really sure how to explain that)