BuzzerBeater Forums

So what ? We allow everything ?

Not even going to respond to that as I haven't asked for "everything." What I would like to see is an admission that GMs make mistakes.

Moderation is not an exact science, it's not head or tail

Well, that's not quite an admission is it?

You would say they are 90, moderation think they are 110, other people will think they are 130.

The only thing important to me there is the part where I say they are 90. You can argue its 110 all you like, but if I know my 90 from my 110, even when the 100 we're talking about is imaginary, because really, that's all the rules here are. Basically you're right; what is against the rules is what the BBs think is against the rules, because as Mike Franks says its not clear what the rules are. And where we don't know what the rules are and what punishments might follow, we're going to get people who feel they're on the wrong end of a decision. Especially in a case where a previously punished user is treated more harshly for doing less than someone who is commiting their first "offence."

I'm truly sorry that you think we're in some sort of circus here. I don't feel that I'm being unfair, except perhaps that it always seems to be you I'm replying to, for which I am also sorry. This is certainly not personal. I've never particularly liked unfairness, and when I see it, I feel free to comment on it.

You keep saying its the BBs who decide what's allowed and apply the rules through the GMs. That implies the GMs operate like bots without any thought, which I think we both know is wrong. I don't argue that the BBs can decide what they like. However I too can decide what I like, and when I don't like something I don't feel its wrong to say so. You'd like me to not to, but unfortunately as long as I stay within the rules, and I believe I do, that's just not going to happen.

As I said, if you say A you have to say B too and deleting the answer to a clearly insulting post, while even saying you agree to the insult in the first place, is not what one would expect.

Well if you feel like your constantly are being bullied by being deleted or what ever...

Not at all. Don't you start, too.

And I understand that your job requires you to pretend there is a line there, but please examine the flawed process with an open mind.

Edited to say that I am impressed and disappointed that you and perpete have sold a few people in this thread that there actually is a line. Very clever of perpete to get going with that 100 ... 110 ... 130 business. Your fictional line seems to have a shadowy life of its own.

Last edited by Mike Franks at 4/17/2016 1:17:47 PM

So what is it that makes the majority clearly see that invisible line and stay under it and some few repeatedly keep going over it?

It's invisible and constantly subjective. It is whatever the GM wants at the moment. As much as you would like to pretend otherwise, the "Most people will know" standard is ... poppycock. (See what a gentle term I used -- I could have been much harsher, but my purpose is not to muddy the waters but to clear the waters and let everybody see and admit the systemic problem ... and hopefully remedy it.)

Edit by Manon: I accidentally edited in a part in your post that was supposed to be in my post. So I edited it out and put it last in my reply to Gully.

Last edited by Manon at 4/17/2016 2:44:47 PM

I believe you can ask The GM's to start treating your posts with 100 acceptance though if you like and you'll very fast see the difference from now and then.

Oh come on now. Seriously? If we're going to have an honest conversation you can do better than that. Throwing sarcasm into a thread does nothing to elevate the conversation.

Last edited by Mike Franks at 4/17/2016 1:34:30 PM

So what is it that makes the majority clearly see that invisible line and stay under it and some few repeatedly keep going over it?

Who says the majority clearly see the invisible line? Apart from the fact that the vast majority of people don't even see the forum I could just as easily say most people are more tolerant of unfairness than others, or they probably don't see the possibility of saying anything making any difference whatsoever.

I know I have seen Perpete say that GM"s are not perfect and make mistakes just like any other user will. And that will never change.

I can't really say anything about Perpete here and how he relates to something that happened with me, because of course I'm not allowed to. However, what I will say is, when a GM does make a mistake, not only is he capable of not admitting his own mistake, but other GMs who enter the same thread also don't admit his mistake (probably because they don't read the conversation and just assume the GM is right), and then add to it by "teaming up" against the user who is being wronged.

That would have been so much easier to say if I was allowed to comment on GM's decisions don't you think?

By the way, I think its a fairly common problem that GMs tend to team up to beat down a particular user. I believe it would be much fairer if once a GM has involved himself as a GM in a thread, then other GMs should stay out it. (Barring an appeal of course.) Ending up in conversations with three people at once tends to become confusing and certainly to making you feel outnumbered.