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12582.124 in reply to 12582.122
Date: 2/8/2008 6:50:01 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
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sorry I just missed that... and that means I am wrong...

I could add that sometimes like now I really miss coz if C 180cm could play against C 224cm... just don`t have what to say... Lithuania is county made of Basketball... It`s our religion... so this is really funny.

Get a random 2.20 guy off the street and play him against a 1.80 who has trained professionally for, say, 10 years. You'd be surprised what the results will be.

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
This Post:
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12582.125 in reply to 12582.123
Date: 2/8/2008 6:52:03 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
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Well, when you consider the reasoning behind this, it makes perfect sense. A player's skill in a given position takes his height into account. Example: a 6'2" strong rebounder is more skilled at rebounding than a 7'2" strong rebounder. However, the 7'2" rebounder is much taller and that makes up for his lack of skill. Therefore, they are equally good rebounders.

Actually, the sign of a good rebounder is when he picks up the ball from the floor. It's called boxing out. If you seal your man well enough far enough from the basket, you might be 5'10 and it wouldn't matter.

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
This Post:
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12582.126 in reply to 12582.125
Date: 2/8/2008 6:58:08 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
5050
Maybe. I'm just explaining the BB reasoning behind the height/skill relationship.

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12582.127 in reply to 12582.126
Date: 2/8/2008 7:02:20 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
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Maybe. I'm just explaining the BB reasoning behind the height/skill relationship.

Oh, I misread you. Yes, you make a very good point

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
This Post:
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12582.128 in reply to 12582.121
Date: 2/8/2008 7:20:06 PM
DUNKsager
III.3
Overall Posts Rated:
3535
You may be right, i don't know. But since height is given in the XML file, i don't see a problem to implement it and that's what i'm asking for. You got your opinion and you are free to use height for formulas or just let it be...

Edited by DonFelipe (08.02.2008 19:21:18 CET)

Last edited by DonFelipe at 2/8/2008 7:21:18 PM

This Post:
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12582.129 in reply to 12582.128
Date: 2/8/2008 7:37:04 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
5050
I think you misunderstood me. I don't care whether or not you use height in your formulas. Whatever makes you happy. I posted in response to an inaccurate piece of information that claimed the game engine took height into account.

This Post:
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12582.130 in reply to 12582.124
Date: 2/8/2008 9:15:23 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
2222
Get a random 2.20 guy off the street and play him against a 1.80 who has trained professionally for, say, 10 years. You'd be surprised what the results will be.


Okey but you take 1.80 with lvl 7blocks ant 2.20 lvl7 blocks... thats mean they both are trained... and if height doesn`t metter that means game engine could do that 1.80 could give maybe 3-5 blocks to 2.20 player... If I would ever saw that in real Basketball mach I could agree with you...

And I have skill`s in basketball... my height is 1.74 and if you put me against 2.20 man he even if not trained would give me at least one block... he just need put his arms up and that would be hard enouth for me to score...

All I wanna say that when there are same skills height of player must give him advantage... sure not big but some...

sure I made some mistakes so sorry for that....

ZyZla - ZyZlūnas ZyZlavotas ~c(=
This Post:
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12582.131 in reply to 12582.125
Date: 2/8/2008 9:24:37 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
2222
Actually, the sign of a good rebounder is when he picks up the ball from the floor. It's called boxing out. If you seal your man well enough far enough from the basket, you might be 5'10 and it wouldn't matter.


Actually I`m not talking about rebounding... coz reabounding depends on where the ball will fall... I`m talking about blocking, scoring and allso defense...

Just maybe allone in Lithuania understand Basketball diferent then other people in the World...

ZyZla - ZyZlūnas ZyZlavotas ~c(=
This Post:
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12582.132 in reply to 12582.131
Date: 2/9/2008 12:14:03 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
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Actually, the sign of a good rebounder is when he picks up the ball from the floor. It's called boxing out. If you seal your man well enough far enough from the basket, you might be 5'10 and it wouldn't matter.


Actually I`m not talking about rebounding... coz reabounding depends on where the ball will fall... I`m talking about blocking, scoring and allso defense...

Just maybe allone in Lithuania understand Basketball diferent then other people in the World...

You know, the fact that you're from Lithuania doesn't make everyone else a basketball idiot.

Let's see: Ben Wallace, one of the greatest interior defenders and shot blockers: 6'9. Paul Pierce, superior inside scorer in the NBA: 6'6. Carlos Boozer, starting power forward for the Utah Jazz, routinely having 20 and 10: 6'8.

In equal amount of training time in this game, taller folks will undoubtedly be better than short dudes. That doesn't mean that every 7-foot tall guy off the street will be walking around blocking shots and scoring like a monster in the paint. I can name at least a dozen of NBA guards that rebound, score inside and block shots better than, say, Nikoloz Tskitishvili, Todd Fuller, Ruben Wolkowyski, Jerome Moiso, Acie Earl, Zan Tabak, Michael Stewart, Bruno Sundov, or Dwayne Scintius. What's common for all these folks: all of them were 6'10 or taller and neither of them could play. So yeah, height helps (in game terms: helps with training speed) but it doesn't make you a player. It's that simple.

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
This Post:
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12582.133 in reply to 12582.130
Date: 2/9/2008 12:16:13 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
225225
Okey but you take 1.80 with lvl 7blocks ant 2.20 lvl7 blocks... thats mean they both are trained...

The way training works in BB, a 1.80 with level 7 blocking has trained in this skill much longer than a 2.20 with level 7 blocks.


Edited by kozlodoev (2/9/2008 12:16:39 AM CET)

Last edited by GM-kozlodoev at 2/9/2008 12:16:39 AM

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
From: jimrtex

This Post:
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12582.134 in reply to 12582.120
Date: 2/9/2008 1:10:10 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
44
This is how BB has implemented height:

A skill in BB is not relative to height, but absolute. So a 5'6 player who has a 48 inch vertical jump, knows how to box out, has strong hands and arms might have a similar rating to a 7'4 guy who is lifting weights so he can hold his arms over his head and started playing BB a month ago. They have roughly the same chance of grabbing the rebound (at least to the game engine). This simplifies the game engine to consider one factor vs. two factors.

When assigning skills, height is likely to be taken into account, but that just means that a larger percentage of 7'4 players will start with respectable rebounding, and very few 5'6 guys.

There is a difference in training speed based on height. This is also somewhat realistist. Our 5'6 player has probably maxed out his rebounding potential. He can't jump much higher, etc. But the 7'4 guy can improve. He might learn to jump a bit, and his timing, boxing out, positioning can improve.

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