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Ok I did edit my question a bit.

He's not supporting anything. He's just saying: '''if you wanna do it, then do it. If you don't want to, then don't. Your decision, not mine."

Precisely.

On a personal level, I don't need to DT. I was ahead of the curve when it came to Arena expansion, and my financial situation is one of the healthiest in BB.

On the other hand, if someone can do it successfully wiith the new controls in place (the agent fees), more power to them.

There are many ways to build a successful team.

If someone builds a better team than me and beats me, I tip my hat and move on to the next game.

just posting what is done in another manager game I play:

1. If you sell a player within 5 weeks of buying him: 95% of the profits will be deducted in taxes
2. If you sell a player between 6-13 weeks of buying him: 50% of the profits will be deducted.
3. If you sell a player after having him for 13 weeks: the tax is 20% of the profits.

If you have bought a player and then decide to sell him, the formula becomes: Sale Price – Bought Price = Profits.

nice 95%!! - wages = a likely loss!!

id like to see (although i appreciate prob difficult to do) top 3 bidders get chance to offer a contract and then the player decides (probably highest offered wage + length of contract) who he will go to...

how crazy / far off is an idea like this???

Edited by Superfly Guy (12/16/2007 12:04:59 PM CET)

Last edited by Superfly Guy at 12/16/2007 12:04:59 PM

IAll daytrading really does is it fixes the holes in the market. If there are times where an individual skill set is undervalued by the market, a daytrader will buy and then sell later at market price or at a time when the market overvalues those skills. The more people who daytrade, the more stable the market will be.

The following is a thought exercise.

Let's say that it is good for the game that the market is stable. Then wouldn't it make sense for BB to implement a mechanism to stabilize the market, perhaps through bot bidders if the price was too low. Or if it is not possible to automate, hire people to bid on players. They could be assigned teams in D.V.

The stability of the market would improve the game experience for all owners, without giving economic advantages to other teams that you are actually competing with.

The TL is a place where players are bought and sold.

If you want to use that mechanism to attempt to DT, go for it.

If you want it to strictly make your team better, go for it.

How do you think about daytrading?

What are advantages of daytrading in your opinion and do you really think daytrading should be a part of the game? Even though it kind of ruins the transfermarket pricewise.

I can't imagine the advantages of daytrading weights bigger than the disadvantages... I hope you can open my eyes then.

Edited by PatjeBono (12/16/2007 1:24:22 AM CET)

DT really doesn't ruin the price market. Imagine you want to sell your best trainee and you put him on the TL for 0. Imagine that there is only one player interested and he would get your player for 1000$. DT would make sure that the price for that player go up to a reasonable value which now is reasonable value minus 20%.

There are other reasons to be against DT which are nicely described in: [message= 9808.35 ]

I thing 20% is a fair obstacle to DT and I suggest to wait this second half of the season and look how the situation evolves

On the other hand draft picks are free, or at worst only the cost of scouting,

DT really doesn't ruin the price market. Imagine you want to sell your best trainee and you put him on the TL for 0. Imagine that there is only one player interested and he would get your player for 1000$. DT would make sure that the price for that player go up to a reasonable value which now is reasonable value minus 20%.

The only thing a daytrader does is buying your trainee for a cheap price ($2000,- in this example) and sell it again for a few tons more. So the daytrader gets a few tons of $$ which should be yours.

well well well.

here is the facts:
Daytrading makes profit. Ofcourse, otherwise it wouldn't even be there.

People who have more time than others can profit more from it, BUT it also takes effort, not just time.
I agree that in this stage (early stage in the history of a game) in BB the profit might be too big. But that is a difrent matter. For now, let me explain why we NEED daytrading.

I think it's easiest to start with saying: let's asume that fees, and taxes, makes it impossible to profit from daytrading.
- Teams would ONLY buy a player when the NEED one.
- Not many teams realy need players, they might be lured into buying one that is better than the ones they have, but you'll see later in this list the chances for that get slim without daytrading.
- because of this very few players will get sold, because only few teams will buy players.
- teams that want to sell a player will not likely get much money, or none at all, for their player, so they'll stick to him and play him rather than buy a new one and having to fire the other.
- because everyone will have a hard time selling their players, the price will drop to 1000$ for almost any player.
-if you have a good player that's worth a lot, you will not get a lot, because 10 other teams are offering the same kind of player for 1000$, because there's only 1 buyer interested in the player.

he fact is, if daytrading is stopped, the TL will have very little 'flow' People will get tired of putting up their players for sale, and it will become a near-dead place.
-teams who need a little extra money in order to survive will have no chance of doing so, they lose matches, they can't buy better players, because they don't have money, they can't sell their own, because nobody's buying, they have few spectators to view their pitty matches... what way will they be able to make money??

I realise that teams who put time and effort in daytrading profit from it, but they also make sure prices don't drop, and every team has a chance of getting money for their players.
Because of daytraders watching the TL closely every day, players will always get a minimum amount of money payed for them, because if the price is not high enough, an other daytrader will bid more. If they are not around, nobody will be there to raise the bid on a starplayer, since maybe only 1 team NEEDS him at that time...

In the end I think my conclusion is that the system used in hattrick (and I never thought I'd say it) is not so bad. With a transfer comparison managers are able to get a nice look at the value of a player. the player will always make a minimum amount of money for his team, and daytraders will not be able to gain VERY much because the rest knows he's not worth THAT much.
This way daytraders keep the marketprices level, while all teams can sell off the players they want, the TL will stay nicely active and the managers putting extra time and effort still are able to gain a little....
I strongly feel that without daytrading, a game, this game, might be doomed. However I AM aware of the downsides. See it like eating. We all need to eat. With our environmental situation and the economic aspects of production we are served a large variety of poisons in our food, still we need to eat, or else we die. ;)
TL is the potatoes of BB, one can live without eating potatoes, but the ones planting potatoes, harvesting them and eating them, get a nice infuse of energy from the food...

So I conclude:
I understand that many see the downsides of daytrading, but I must strongly advise to think about it carefully, and also take into account the effect it would have if daytrading is stopped. I don't think anyone would stop eating because they know there's a little amount of poison in every food, because they know what would happen if they stop eating. No I ask to start knowing what would happen if we stop daytrading...

On the other hand draft picks are free, or at worst only the cost of scouting,

If I've invested 10k/wk for 14 weeks, those kids cost me around 47k apiece. And they should be original team members, as I've been paying each one over 3k/wk for a full season.

The only thing a daytrader does is buying your trainee for a cheap price ($2000,- in this example) and sell it again for a few tons more. So the daytrader gets a few tons of $$ which should be yours.

Not to defend or promote day-trading, but if that money should have been yours, why didn't you set the selling price that high to begin with? If you really wanted those "tons of $$" in the first place, you should ask for it. It won't cost you a dime to re-list that player if he doesn't sell.