This has taken a turn (and turn and turn) for the worse.
I'm going to close it, we certainly have enough sides of the argument to make a decision if we need to and this has degenerated into flaming.
Please play nice!
/Juiced
                                
                                
                                
                                
                                
                                
                                    NO ONE at this table ordered a rum & Coke 
 Charles: Penn has some good people 
 A CT? Really? 
 Any two will do 
 Any three for me 
 Any four will score 
 Any five are live