BuzzerBeater Forums

Hi,

To be honest, people shouldnt listen to what the NT managers tell them, at least I dont. Its in your own best intrest to have a good GS. The amount of minutes are important but the difference between 48 and 70 aint that big as the size of the discussion you guys are having about it.

NT managers contact you and tell you how you should train your players, how many minutes they should play, etc. I dont really mind the insight of another manager, in fact I really appreciate it, but I think Im experienced enough to know how I want to train MY player.

Problem is, some people dont know whats best for their team. Letting a player get in bad shape just to be able to win one more game just isnt the right decision (at least not in 9 out of the 10 cases). Giving the player a good training and a good GS is in your own best intrest.

So its just up to NT managers to select players from managers of whom they know they are able to get a good GS. Dont try to tell a manager from 4th division (with all due respect) with a 100k salary C how he should manage his minutes and player because he wont understand the reason behind it.

In the end, GS is the most important thing about this game. And too many people dont know that. BB isnt about salary, its about GS (as LoD says). Just as it isnt about having 17 JS 9 OD guards but more about having 14 JS 14 OD with a GS of 8-9.

Greetings,

Kwyjibo

Hi,

To be honest, people [shouldnt listen to what the NT managers tell them, at least I dont. Its in your own best intrest to have a good GS. The amount of minutes are important but the difference between 48 and 70 aint that big as the size of the discussion you guys are having about it.

NT managers contact you and tell you how you should train your players, how many minutes they should play, etc. I dont really mind the insight of another manager, in fact I really appreciate it, but I think Im experienced enough to know how I want to train MY player.

Problem is, some people dont know whats best for their team. Letting a player get in bad shape just to be able to win one more game just isnt the right decision (at least not in 9 out of the 10 cases). Giving the player a good training and a good GS is in your own best intrest.

So its just up to NT managers to select players from managers of whom they know they are able to get a good GS. Dont try to tell a manager from 4th division (with all due respect) with a 100k salary C how he should manage his minutes and player because he wont understand the reason behind it.

In the end, GS is the most important thing about this game. And too many people dont know that. BB isnt about salary, its about GS (as LoD says). Just as it isnt about having 17 JS 9 OD guards but more about having 14 JS 14 OD with a GS of 8-9.

Greetings,

Kwyjibo

i agree with most off the stuff in the post, except for one thing: people should listen to the NT coach, if he has something valuable to say. in small community's, being a NT coach is often pure luck cause you got 1 or 2 votes. however, if you've got 50 or more people voting, then the winner of that election should be rather competent to know what he is doing.

Also, i haven't got much experience with training of PG's. done SG's, PF's, SF and will be doing some C's shortly, but i haven't got any own experience with training of PG's. that why, in a NT team ( and especially in the U21) you need managers helping others who know how to train that position.

the big difference between a NT manager and U21 = NT has trained players, he needs to be a good analyst and know his tactics well. a U21 manager needs to be an advisor in training more than anything, cause the NT depends 100% from what the U21 can offer ( ok 98%, since SF's usually aren't at a good lvl till they reach the age of 23, but for PG, SG, PF's and C's, i depend for 100% of Sum)

i know that what NT managers ask from their players is often very difficult to meet. But they need to ask it, to try and have the best possible team for their country. i don't insist on training someone if the manager doesn't want to... all he needs to tell me is, i don't want to, and that's final for me.

Rev

I think I used the wrong word. I should have said "People dont have to listen to the NT manager" ...

What I meant to say is, all the advise you get from the NT is very usefull but sometimes NT managers think that a player is owned by the NT instead of the club. The clubs pay the salary and the small amount of merchandise you get due to the NT players isnt much compared to the salary. NT managers should depend on favors, it might sound selfish but its true though. NT managers depend on the goodwill of the club managers.

Kwyjibo

can't say that your wrong here ;)

anyhow, i made some changes from the NT

dropped a few players, and took in a few others. got a few nice surprizes too :D

it's true you can bring up the positives for the managers about doing what you ask them to. That is a thing that is never wrong.

on the other parts however, each person is different, and each person needs an other approach to reach your goal. The difficulty is that since this is the internet, and you don't know the other people well enough, it's a game of gamble.
So;e will continue if you persist, others will react the opposite way, even the slightest 'push' they feel will make them turn the other way.

In general, my personal feeling about this is, that when a manager is left open a wider range of options, they are more likely to follow your lead. tell him to do things on strickt terms, and he will turn away.
Managers like to follow all the terms the NT coaches give them in order to offer the best possible player. If you set a restriction that is too harsh, making the manager not comply to that 1 thing, he is likely not to care too much about breaking other wishes as well.

That's why my advise would be: ask what you like to have, but don't narrow his options when it has no use.
Narrowing his play-minutes to 60-75 to get an exelent GS is not needed when the GS would be equal if you'd ask him to keep the player between 48 and 77 minutes for example...

to end my discussion about this, a small example:
you ask that the NT player
1) gets full training each week
2) plays between 60 and 75 minutes
3) is trained with 1position training only
4) is trained in passing for the next 3 weeks

now, let's say the player is playing PG, and he has 43 minutes of play. The manager is still willing to put him up as back-up, not as starter anymore, but rather not play him in the next and last game of that week at all.

he sees he needs to get him 60 minutes, and knows he won't reach it with a back-up position, so to reach that criteria, he must put him as starter. But he realy doesn't want that at all, so he won't. Since he can't reach that, he might judge to just do what he likes best, not play him in the next game. It doesn't bother him that he doesn't get the 48 minutes for full training, as he didn't reach his limit for minutes anyway. s it turns out it might be even more interesting to traing JR this week, given the minutes of the players, and that means a 2 position training as well. Result: screwed up week NT-wise.
if criteria 2 would have been 48 - 75 minutes, he would likely have set him up as back-up, meeting ALL requested stuff and with no loss of GS at all...

I know this is a rather drastic and maybe exagerated example, but similar stuff might happen, and WILL happen if you set the limits to strickt. In the end the managers even will totally ignore your requests because it takes them too long to figure out how to comply, or it's not how they like to play, or any other reason.

Therefor, I like Revo's approach. If they say no, don't insist, unless their no means a total waste of the player. Because by pushing your luck, you might loose the player altogether, and will have to start over with an other one.

Hey guys

I need a motivated manager to continue with Adriaessen

His salary is high for me and i have an other project for my team

I think his price is good and he could be at his place in BBL
What do you think?

I think LoD can do you this favor for the NT :p

Im just joking, price is too high I think. You wont sell it for anything more than 3.250.000 euro. I think.

too high :-s

after all efforts to make him one of best big men of belgium

it's too unfair :-p

well... this isn't hattrick and I noticed a long time ago that youngt promising players here cost a lot, and when they get a little older and are trained, they aren't worth much more, just a little more.
The good part in BB is that even though the players don't gain much in money value, they do improve a lot better on the field, where they belong.
Players belong on the field, not on the TL.

To make this short: training doesn't bring a lot of money in this game, just look at it as a small extra each manager can earn on top of his earnings due to winning and moving up the ladder, not as a main money income.

[... and yes I choose to let myself sink down the ladder to train youngsters, and yes I am crazy... ]

I would never buy this guy, not even for 1M, as I am only interested in shaping the perfect players.
For a C a jumpshot should be no higher then 5, so he already is 2 levels too high. This will set him back on other skills when he reaches his potential (btw, didn't he reach his potential yet??). His blocking is so far behind he will never catch up, so it's impossible to shape him in the perfect C anymore. ;þ

Last edited by Lord of Doom at 8/29/2010 12:43:41 PM

Hey guys

I need a motivated manager to continue with Adriaessen

His salary is high for me and i have an other project for my team

I think his price is good and he could be at his place in BBL
What do you think?

i hate to say it, but since the TL has collapsed when BB raised salary's by 10%, the prices of all players have dropped, but in particular for C's.

most people don't want to pay more than 50k for their C, first div teams sometimes want to go for 100 to 150k C's. you'll need some luck to find a new owner for him, but i fear that you won't sell him for more than 2.7M

if you look at the C's out their, you'll see some that look like Adriaansen with a TL price of 2.5M and even they don't haven't had a bid yet.

all you can hope for is that the Belgian NT flag will help him get some extra cash, but i wouldn't expect someone to bid that kinda of cash for a C at this point. 3M might work, anything above that is very lucky. but i do hope that you'll get that cash for your player tho.

Rev

ps: LoD, i disagree with you on the JS idea. some C's are better for inside play's, others for outside tactics. example: if i play outside tactic, i'll want to have high rebounding and high ID on my C's. Shotblocking will be usefull then, but his IS lvl can be much lower, since he won't need it that much. however, if he's got JS and a bitt of JR ( like Adriaansens) then that C can take longer rang shots, creating a bad match-up for the defending C (especially if the defending C has no OD) and thus, not only could he make a longer shot, but he'll get more easely to the FT line aswell, while bringing the other C in Faul trouble...

i've probably got one 'perfect' C like you'd have em in mind, but the rest are all on the team because they got a special advantage (that includes Liessens, tho he'll most likely will be replaced next season by the 'improved' version of Liessens)