BuzzerBeater Forums

Hi everyone,

well, I guess this was to be expected. This update, which we know to be the least appealing but probably the hardest to implement, has seen the light of day. It had to be done in order to get to the next step - a truly major update that will feature things that actually directly affect the game. Yes, we are aware this is just eye-candy and yes, we are aware that things could have been done like other games did it (have fixed infrastructure buildings and arena surroundings - no customization options, basically the same graphics for everyone). But, I wanted us to do something original, be different, bold... Was I wrong?

Reading the replies, in most people's eyes this was unnecessary. Maybe so, time will tell. Once we fix all the bugs, maybe some of you will grow to like it? I see jokeru played with it even after he bashed it initially, so there's hope. And yeah, I won't apologize even if it turns out not to be popular or add real value. When you work, make decisions, sometimes you make the wrong ones. I am not perfect, I do make mistakes but I refuse to give up my vision. Truly, I believe this was not for naught, maybe just as a team exercise, even though most of you guys seem so very eager to bash it. Even though it is just a middle step in something bigger and was announced as just that.

Now, for the bugs - yeah, I'm aware this one was full of them. Still has some too. But, we'll keep working on it, improving it. It will give us more experience going forward. And this is just it - if nothing else - experience. We have new team members in our dev team, they need to learn by working on something so they can get to know the ropes. They can't code a full mobile app right away, steps need to be made to get there. We're a small company and can't just buy ourselves a mobile app like it's nothing. We need time and experience so look at it this way - this is just a part of that process.

So, to summarize, I am sad to see such responses here. Not only are they not constructive, as ned pointed out, they might even be counterproductive. We're human too, behind these creations stand people that created them and they don't like when their work is treated in such a manner. It's easy to criticize and hard to contribute, but hey, that's just how internet works.

Long story short, you don't need to worry about us spending more dev time on features like these after the 3rd segment of the Arena Designer. We're going to be switching our focus on some long time needed back-end development and the team can learn by doing that too. The dev calendar will have to be put on hold for a bit, but it will be back eventually. When it is, I'm pretty sure we'll be better equipped to implement tougher, more complex ideas. For now, this is what a small dev team can provide (a team still in training, too).

I do really hope you'll like the next update anyway. A true optimist never gives up hope and I've already seen some pretty funny creations with the designer - so why don't you take it just as it is - some light-hearted fun you can ignore if you don't like, that's easy. Or it should be, at least. If it gives you sensible chuckle here and there - even better.

Seeing the update and this forum thread, I was very pessimistic about what we could see (like most of those who have written) also because it not fair for you, despite the effort you put in, apparently not moving in the direction right.

However, your last message, where due to the poor reception for the community you gave us some info that you probably did not plan to give us, about the dev team some projections that you have in mind .. I have returned the hope that BB can have "new winds", despite this (perhaps) stumbling, the possibility that you n your team implements an app, and other new ideas, is very good news because it shows that there is an idea behind what is happening.

On the other hand, I think it would be good to take the community a bit more into account (some playing for more than 10 yearss, we have become old ), since I think that most want this game to continue to progress and add more users, and for this many may have good ideas, some small and relatively easy to implement*, that could collaborate in the common objectives of yours, your team and the community.

* empowering local communities for example: http://www.buzzerbeater.com/community/forum/read.aspx?thread=289296&m=1
-improving the chat, as Darkonako said
- giving more advantages to new players, so they can be more competitive compared to those that we have been capitalizing for a long time. etc.

Sorry Ned, we know each other from such a long time but... Do you speak English? Because your reply doesn't fit at all with my message.
I said I want this game to go further and you reply "I am pretty sure you won't quit the game". Indeed I wont. I love this game. It is written in every single post I made here.
I wrote "no blame on Marin for the effort, it's the direction which is wrong because of wrong decision making and missing project management perspective" and your reply is telling me "I can't believe you think Marin develops things to close the game".
Just lol man, read carefully please.

Last edited by NdR619 - Pilipinas U21 at 10/19/2018 1:31:24 AM

Hey Marin,
Thanks for coming here first of all. It's hard to be constructive I think in this case.
Because what some of us are trying to speak about is not the feature (or the last features) itself but the perspective as a long term value to keep this project alive and to allow BB to grow instead of dying.
There is no common ground here to say OK there is something good which can leave room for improvements, at least for what I think.
As many others pointed out, we're losing many users and the vast majority are new users. Why this feature should persuade them to stay in the game? If I want to play sim city I play sim city and if I'm a newbie I came here because of basketball. Because I am looking for the self proclaimed best managerial basketball game.
And I do not have 4 m to invest, just for the record.
This is just an example, I mean if the global meaning of these features is to give people something futile to entertain themselves while we're dramatically losing users that's fine.
But on a long term (and to me also a short term) vision this is worthless. What add to the product? Do you tell friends to play BB because "hey you know? You can play around drawing things to make your arena looking better (in old fashioned 90s graphics but yeah these are personal preferences, and I even can say I like it)".
This is my only point and I repeat myself not to blame you yourself because the effort you put is admirable as a last man standing.
BB is a product and when a product is underperforming you have to add clear value.
I saw something similar with a videogame project I've been involved as a narrative designer in the past. They kept adding graphics stuff because they had no money for demo, 3d videos or whatever more deep into the game to attract sponsor or crowd funds.

Edit: needless to say the project failed and my amazing story didn't see the light 😂

Last edited by NdR619 - Pilipinas U21 at 10/19/2018 3:16:22 AM

So, to summarize, I am sad to see such responses here. Not only are they not constructive, as ned pointed out, they might even be counterproductive. We're human too, behind these creations stand people that created them and they don't like when their work is treated in such a manner. It's easy to criticize and hard to contribute, but hey, that's just how internet works.

!!!

Speaking of bugs, the Change Design button on the arena page seems to be disabled. Can you please resolve this?

:(
I understand that money from my supporter account goes on this ? ;/
Cannot you gather the people propositions, prepare some voting, then prios for the most wanted and develop them ?
Now it seems like time killing by doing some almost rubbish stuff.

OK, as I understand, this was done to add space around arena so we can add useful buildings when the next update is released. I find that OK, maybe the reception would be better if last two updates were merged into one.

This way it's expected that people would be upset because they expected more. But they really shouldn't because BB-Marin said that this will be purely to add space around arena and that's it.

But the next update, where we will get medical center, I suppose training center and couple of more buildings will be the real deal. I repeat, people would be less angry if they got all of that at once.

Probably, as others said, it would have been better to publish the second and third developments together. Sometimes you hit, sometimes you miss in this kind of things and you'll always get criticism, but after all, we all appreciate your efforts in keeping this game together and trying something new. I believe the biggest issue this time was the number of bugs rather than the idea itself - I actually had some fun putting together my new arena and actually wish we could have some extra items to add to the landscape. Don't let criticism sadden you, but take it as a motivation to do better next time instead.
I think it's right you take a break now to focus on the back-end and when you are ready for a new front-end development, maybe try to involve the Forum community, propose your ideas BEFORE you start working on them (I still think implementing a poll system to cast a vote would be brilliant!) and use the users' feedback to create something the majority of them will like - you'll see you will receive way more appreciation! This is my constructive advice.
Keep on learning, trying, failing and improving, dev team - we may be very critical at times, but all we want is to improve and keep alive this game we love! :)

Last edited by Talisker 🥃🏀 at 10/19/2018 4:26:32 PM