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183384.4 in reply to 183384.3
Date: 5/5/2011 7:27:16 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
192192
Vince Young has been a good pro, but has been coached horribly. Pocket passers certainly aren't immune to busting, either. (How's Leinart working out?)

Vick threw well in 2007, the year before he was imprisoned. He threw and ran for over 1000 yards and had an above-average QB rating (which is a misleading stat for scramblers, as it doesn't count rush attempts).

Last edited by RiseandFire at 5/5/2011 7:29:02 PM

This Post:
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183384.5 in reply to 183384.4
Date: 5/5/2011 7:43:01 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
9191
I disagree wholheartedly. Harrington was atlantas QB in 07, but in 06 Vick was 20th in passer rating at 75.7. He was 31st in passing % that year too. the only player who did worse amongst starters in completion %? You guessed it.....Vince Young.

Hard to use Lienart as a litmus considering he never really got a chance. Even so, of course you can name a whole bunch of pocket passers who failed, but you can count on one hand the scramblers who have succeeded.

Talking passing, not rushing. I think Vick was insanely good as a rusher, defenses had to scheme completely differently for Vick. I think results speak for themselves when it comes to what kind of QB is successful in the NFL.

Would you want Vince Young to be the starting QB on your team? My answer to this is 'hell no!'

This Post:
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183384.6 in reply to 183384.4
Date: 5/6/2011 1:46:58 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
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Vince Young has been a good pro, but has been coached horribly. Pocket passers certainly aren't immune to busting, either. (How's Leinart working out?)


Vince Young had a season where he refined the Dilfer concept of putting the defense/special teams in scoring position, and that got him Rookie of the Year over the infinitely more deserving MJD. But I don't think coaching was ever the problem there. I wonder if he had a major wake-up call like Vick did and went to the right situation, if he could possibly become a good player. I hate Vick and always will for what he did, but he certainly looked like a QB and not a RB with an arm for the first time in his career this season.

From: Heathcoat

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183384.8 in reply to 183384.7
Date: 5/6/2011 8:13:45 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
9191
.

That's what Vick seemed to learn this year and how he got so good. You have to get the QB accuracy and learn to read defenses before you can use the threat of running as a weapon.



Exactly. A very telling stat (so I am told) is completion % on 3rd down. I think Vick also had help from being on a team that could take full advantage of his talents. That offense has alot of weapons for a QB to go to and the scheme mixing him with the wide open spread has to be a defensive nightmare. We will see if it was a fluke or not this year. Personally I have a hard time forgiving him too and it wouldnt upset me if he fell flat on his face this year.

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183384.9 in reply to 183384.5
Date: 5/7/2011 3:29:22 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
137137

Hard to use Lienart as a litmus considering he never really got a chance. Even so, of course you can name a whole bunch of pocket passers who failed, but you can count on one hand the scramblers who have succeeded.


Lienart has a weak arm and spends too much time in hot tubs with co-eds....he's never going to be a great pro.

This Post:
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183384.10 in reply to 183384.9
Date: 5/7/2011 12:31:07 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
9191


Lienart has a weak arm and spends too much time in hot tubs with co-eds....he's never going to be a great pro.



True. I still dont think he would have done any worse that Anderson last season. Thinking Anderson was the answer was about the most foolish thing I have seen a coach do ever. I would take Lienart's accuracy over Anderson's arm strength any day. I have heard that Lienart doesnt take it seriously enough, and that wont do.

When someone talks about QB arm strength I am reminded of two things. Most succesful modern offenses dont throw the 50 yard pass much anymore, at least with alot of success (See: Raiders). My all time favorite QB and the best I ever saw play the position had a pretty weak arm comparatively. Guy by the name of Joe Montana.

This Post:
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183384.11 in reply to 183384.10
Date: 5/8/2011 10:15:39 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
137137
Yeah, but you need arm strength to also make many short passes too...but mostly I think Lienart's biggest problem has been his work ethic.