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Whats going on depth charts??

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This Post:
00
261684.40 in reply to 261684.37
Date: 8/4/2014 9:48:24 PM
Neverwinter
CGBBL
Overall Posts Rated:
621621
1. Don't put 10th player.

2. Have two important trainees, and whatever third one, so you can sacrifice his minutes if one of the two important ones get subbed out.

This Post:
00
261684.41 in reply to 261684.39
Date: 8/4/2014 9:53:01 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
766766
yes this is true, but im not sure how it relates to subbing?

If at all?

I remember i had a player who had Prolific stamina, or something around that. and basically, if i set him as Starter, and NOT backup/reserve - he still played 48 mins.

Thats the game engine deciding that he is better off remaining in the game compared to the subs.
That problem has always been the case, the new change is makign it such that he doesn't get penalised in his game shape.

Now how does this relate to subbing in garbage time? not sure. A higher stamina player will still get preference to play minutes, so im assuming in the situation of garbage time the game engine does the following.

- Player set at Starter has Stamina of X. Does any other player on the team have higher stamina? Yes? Sub that player in.

So thats nothing new. I dont think the recent change will affect this process.

This Post:
11
261684.43 in reply to 261684.37
Date: 8/4/2014 10:02:47 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
you said losing a minute here any there was not a big deal right. Well the reason i'm worried about it is from reading that if your trainee gets 48 minutes but not 48+ he gets about 10% less training. So that sounds rather significant to me, is that in fact correct? Based on that when my guys get 44-47 minutes they have to be losing like 15%+ of that weeks training and thats just pretty frustrating.


There's nothing official, but I've got a lot of confidence in the data from the training crowd source project and Joey Ka's additional analysis: (203921.375)

Based on that, the "10% loss" line would be more around 45 min, 32 seconds. And remember again that the amount of training lost by this, if it happened 10 times in a season, would be roughly the same as missing one week due to injury.

This Post:
11
261684.44 in reply to 261684.42
Date: 8/5/2014 12:47:21 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
766766
ahhhhhh but i was sufficiently ambiguous was i not?

Prolific stamina, or something around that.


....that and i always get the 3 p's mixed up. Prominent/Prolific/Proficient. All the same as far as im concerned. Skill table for me is Respectable > Strong > something with P in it > Sensational etc.
haha




This Post:
11
261684.45 in reply to 261684.43
Date: 8/5/2014 4:21:12 AM
Headless Thompson Gunners
Naismith
Overall Posts Rated:
708708
Second Team:
Canada Purple Haze BC
I've got a lot of confidence in the data from the training crowd source project


The numbers there however indicate this harsher scenario:

47 M =90%
46 M =81%
45 M =72%
44 M =65%
43 M =58%

So 45:32 would cost closer to 26% or so

This Post:
00
261684.46 in reply to 261684.45
Date: 8/5/2014 6:28:06 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
536536

Nice stats


By chance do you have any statistics on the "output" of different level trainers (based on 48 mins)

This Post:
11
261684.47 in reply to 261684.45
Date: 8/5/2014 8:18:56 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
I've got a lot of confidence in the data from the training crowd source project


The numbers there however indicate this harsher scenario:

47 M =90%
46 M =81%
45 M =72%
44 M =65%
43 M =58%

So 45:32 would cost closer to 26% or so


Except that those numbers were not based on any sort of analysis, just as placeholders. The related messages:
(203921.182)
Wozzvt posted (in response to yellowcake's question):

Here is my question....
I had a player get 44 minutes at C, he also got 16 at PF(due to a foul out)..So do I train 1 position or 2?
I have always thouht that 44 minutes(40 and above) for 1 position training(ID) would be worth more than the 48 minutes(full training) for 2 position. Well, I went back and checked my old trainings and it seems the 44 minutes was only a .57 out of the 1(full training for 1 position) where when I did 2 position ID in the offseason it gave me a .70 for the fulltraining. Are these numbers for partial trainings accurate?

no... it was just a guess i put in (min/48)^3 just to be able to have something. that's one of the things on the list to look at closely, though.



I don't see anything in the thread that indicates they ever updated that based on any analysis, but of course I don't see anything that says they didn't either.

This Post:
00
261684.48 in reply to 261684.47
Date: 8/5/2014 11:15:01 AM
Headless Thompson Gunners
Naismith
Overall Posts Rated:
708708
Second Team:
Canada Purple Haze BC
From the training site, personal player
what happens when players get less than 48 minutes:

Outside Shooting SG (47 mins), +0.9 (of 1)
Pressure PG (46 mins), +0.81 (of 1)
Outside Shooting SG (45 mins), +0.72 (of 1)
Passing PG (44 mins), +0.65 (of 1)

Last edited by Headless T Gunner at 8/5/2014 11:15:57 AM

This Post:
00
261684.49 in reply to 261684.48
Date: 8/5/2014 11:27:03 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
From the training site, personal player
what happens when players get less than 48 minutes:

Outside Shooting SG (47 mins), +0.9 (of 1)
Pressure PG (46 mins), +0.81 (of 1)
Outside Shooting SG (45 mins), +0.72 (of 1)
Passing PG (44 mins), +0.65 (of 1)


Right, but I don't see anything anywhere that those figures were based on any analysis of the data. Wozzvt posted early on that the minutes estimates were just a placeholder value. Of course, Joey Ka's conclusion doesn't indicate anything like that either. I know my anecdotal experience tracking my training was that losing 2-3 minutes did not really bump any of my players off of their progression compared to the 100% in a significant manner, but I think at this point I've already spent more energy on the topic than it's particularly worth anyhow.

From: jv03

This Post:
00
261684.50 in reply to 261684.49
Date: 8/5/2014 6:48:56 PM
Telecasters
III.9
Overall Posts Rated:
100100
Second Team:
Telecasters II
I agree with this, I've stated before (and been shot down) that I believe the training equation is more likely the following:

(Minutes played/48) squared

This means a player who played 36 minutes at a trained position would recieve approxametly 56% of the training. This seems much closer to what has happened with my secondary trainee (my third trainee). He has often received 36-44 minutes of training and does not seem to be falling too far behind the training simulator spreadsheet (I think it was made by Joseph Ka).

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