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Its just one sugestion, but the point is, we have find a way to keep daytrading alive AND create other ways to be sucessful aswell. And it shouldn´t be possible to use both ways in one time,so they should be releated to each other

the problem is indeed the balance. now things are quite unbalanced concerning trading vs training

hm, I doubt that even if there is a balance the complaints will stop. As long as there are people who are jealous of the profit which is made by DT-ing, there will be complaints. Money made by DT-ing is additional to all other money made by teams (like training), and that is the reason why the ones who either don't have the time, or the skill, or are to lazy can not make this kind of extra money, and it will always be critisized.

If in some way BB finds out how to balance the money input for a team versus a DT-ing team, then DT will also simply stop, since DT-ers will not make the effort anymore while they can't gain something from it...
If like you say there is balance between trading, and training (if possible at all), nobody will trade anymore, because it is far more easy to train...

I like they way you think, I just doubt it is realistic it will ever be succesfully achieved.

Now let's all get off each other's backs, and leave every manager the opportunity to play the game as they like to play it

I don´t want to restart the DT discussion, but LoD, thats exactly that what I think. And imo we are forced to use DT to be competitive against DT. And I wanna be sucessful.

Whatever.

I don´t want to restart the DT discussion, but LoD, thats exactly that what I think. And imo we are forced to use DT to be competitive against DT. And I wanna be sucessful.

I think this is quite a negative look...

I do not use DT, I also did not need DT to be able to be succesfull.
I DT-ed for a small period of time in the begining when it indeed was very easy to do, and estimated it gave me about 300k of profit. Other profit came from buying players, training them up, and selling them relatively fast, but that is NOT daytrading. I also had 1 time I bought a player to use, and then listed him for a big amount because he was realy good and I decided that if someone else wanted him they'd have to pay enough. He got sold right away, and I actually felt real bad that I lost my best player. Practically this is DT, because I sold him again after buying him, but I had no intention to sell him again anythime soon at the time I bought him, so...in my opinion DT is just buying the player only to sell him again, and I bought him to play.
Anyway, it actually does not realy matter, what I want to say is: I had a full season of 140k wages behind me, and be sure this took all the profit I made from trading away, and more. I did not have this aomount of players because I was DT, because if so, I'd sell them much more quickly. I just felt confident having 25 to 30 players available to field in any given situation. Since this season I systematically lowered this amount of players by firing some and selling some, because frankly, it is not worth the money to be able to field so many. The clue is, I had more expenses from extra wages compared to normal teams than I earned with DT-ing, and still I have a succesfull team.
Nobody has to DT to be able to get a succesfull team. Being able to get a succesfull team FASTER, is something else, ofcourse when you make extra money, you go faster! But if you compare teamprogress/time spend , I'm almost sure non-daytraders will get a higher rate! so it's all relative.

As for me personally, I wouldn't even mind if a BB flipped a coin and let it decide if DT should be banished or not, I truly do not care. But I don't think they have that luxury, they will need to be carefull with the steps they take and the thing they do with their game, and I am truly curious as to what road they will walk with DT-ing.

It isn't buying a player to sell him that anyone has a problem with. The problem comes when are buying and selling absurd numbers of players on a daily basis.

Trading is a good and viable part of the game economics, it just shouldn't be the only part that matters.

Look, we are supposed to manage everything the game offers to be successful right? When you can earn money in the millions by doing nothing but trading you have no need to worry about anything else. You don't need to train because you can succesively buy better players. You don't need to build an arena because you don't need ticket revenue. You don't even need to worry about things like trying to make sure you win TV games. You can carry a better bench than other teams, giving you a batter shot at the cup.

As a manager game you are supposed to have to manage all aspects of the game with skill. If the market is set up so that someone can make enough money that no other aspect of the game is difficult then it is no longer a basketball management game, it becomes a agme of who can work the market best.

People keep arguing that daytraders have to still know how to set up a lineup and tactics and things like that but this is ridiculous. So what? You still have a huge advantage over those without the time to daytrade because you can buy a better roster without worryiong about how to allocate funds.

I think that the ability to make a profit on the market is an important part of the game, but it should not outweigh other aspects of the game.

Also, if it takes sooo much skill to daytrade, as has been argueds repeatedly, then capping the number of trades would still leave you skilled traders with an advantage because you would use your alloted number of trades more efficiently.

I agree with you here 100% !


Still I have something to react to. ;)
If a player does not need to think or worry about anything, just making millions of $ by DT, how fun is the game then? I know how much I'd love to play if it did not matter how I put my line-ups, I'm sure I'd already stopped playing.

Let them be, and let them win championships year after year, after 3 seasons they grow tired of it and quit. Yes another team will come along and take his place, and quit too, eventually you will be among teams in your country who know you, see you, scout your progresses, will get to know you as a steady value in the game, you will get their respect, even though you might never be able to win anything big because capitalists get into they way, the ones popping their team in their midsts by DT-ing and falling out of the game after a few seasons of no-fun-being-champion will not get their respect, and will be quickly forgotten.

What are we all playing for?
The championship? the cup? I think not, we all play to be respected by others, how others awe over our teams. Yes we all strive for the championship, and maybe the cup, but only because it will make others think waaaw, he made it! do you think they will feel the same about someone who did not give a thing about the tactics, but just DT-ed his way up there without anything else? Guess not, so don't be jealous, play your own game, and be proud of what you accomplish, and the respect from others you earn! It is like buying friendship, I don't think anyone has become truely happy by doing this, it's the ones with true love and friendship for each other who experience happyness, some things can't be bought !

Obviously some people are making a small mint on day-trading. I'm not necessary against that...but I guess you have to ask a question about what you want BB to be.

Is it a basketball simulation where the best teams are those who understand basketball and acquire/train/draft players and play tactics in a superior manner to their opponents, win games.

Or is it an economic simulation (some might argue that HT has gone too far down this path [not necessarily me though]), where those that manage the economics of the game are able to buy better players/pay higher salaries and win games.

Of course, unless you do away with all money, there is some balance between these two approaches. But certain rules and decisions mean you move more toward one than the other.

Steve
Bruins

Last edited by Solana_Steve at 4/16/2008 6:51:14 PM

I don't play this game for the respect of others. Why would I care if someone I have never met respects me? It is nice to get along with people, and makes the game more enjoyable, but earning respect from random people around the world is not a priority.

I play this game for the reason I play any game, competition is fun. However competition on an unever playing field is much less enjoyable.

You say why not let them be, but I say why not level the field?

I think that trading MUST be a part of the economics, but it needs to be of similar importance to other economic factors, not an all-important economic factor.

Thanks for the answer. After a couple of days thinking about BB and DT and I´m no longer sure at all what my opion about that is. But I really enjoy this discussion. Its nice that so many users care about BB. After all the pros and cons about DT - I can´t say what the best solution is. For the moment, I´ll invest my time and energy to improve my team :)