BuzzerBeater Forums

What is the minimum wage in your league?

In my league it is 135k whereas a team with 330k of wage succeeded into being second in conf1 (low competition) and average wage of the division was about 420k (before the end of the season where a few teams recruited big players, half of teams already saved sold several players and the few ones still playing for not being relegated kept the same high wage).
In my opinion, minimum wage should be about 250k.

In French D1, I just asked to Megadez. He or I will let you know

Last edited by Dunker Joe at 5/29/2012 5:24:03 AM

In french first division: $ 262 658

There is an easy way to stop tanking: no fans buy tickets of teams losing intentionally. No fans in a tanking team's arena -> no money through tanking.

Here is example of some hardcore tanking
http://www.buzzerbeater.com/league/1104/overview.aspx?sea...

This is what you can notice in this example:

-teams are not only tanking because of the money, but because they want to have the best draft pick so it's double profit.
-when teams notice that they won't get eliminated they can also tank and play next season in same division.
-there is also tanking for 5th place.

Conclusion: it's crazy

Possible solutions:
-Increase salary floor.
-Don't let teams with technical loses draft players or they should draft the last.
-Decrease the profitability of 5th place.
-Introduce fines for teams that for example in the first divisions earned over 5M in one season and lost over 90 percent of the their games.

Last edited by Ghost Master at 5/29/2012 7:28:44 AM

There is an easy way to stop tanking: no fans buy tickets of teams losing intentionally. No fans in a tanking team's arena -> no money through tanking.

I like this idea but perhaps less severe.

In reality, who is going to watch a team that loses by 40 game after game after game? You may get some fans for the OTHER team who will want to come watch, but not many will want to watch your team. Quite often, constantly losing teams from many sports risk losing their place in the league, let alone teams that don't have a roster to compete whatsoever.

Reduced fan arena income = less desirable to tank.

In fact, under this system, a team could "do badly" and still make an ok profit, as long as they aren't losing by 40 game after game after game. It would have to be managed well, just like a winning team has to be managed well.

This can be mitigated somewhat by giving everyone warning that such a feature will be implemented (and when it will begin) i.e. announce it two seasons before it actually takes effect.

If there's a maximum amount of time that it takes to reach the top level of 'loyalty' (e.g. three seasons), it doesn't significantly favour more established teams, as teams with the same roster for seven seasons will get the same loyalty bonus as teams that have been together for three seasons (or whatever the maximum is).

This is exactly what I was thinking. It might even work if it's half a season that it takes for a team to "gel", also adding in a random factor for each player.

Newer teams would be barely affected because they start in the lowest league and are competing against similar, newer teams. After a season or four, depending on the strength of the league, they move up and, if they've managed well, their players will have the "gel" factor already sorted.

Before we get too far into suggestions that involve fines or penalties, we should really make sure we understand exactly what the problem is and why it's happening, or why it has become a strategy.

As I see it, the problem is tanking i.e. losing games on purpose. To come up with a suitable solution, we must also understand why teams are tanking.

Possible reasons...

1. Because it's possible to make more money, compared to paying for a roster that allows you to be competitive.

2. Because the team has no hope of being competitive in that division anyway.

3. Because the team wants the first draft pick.

4. Because there's a bot in the 8th spot (or another tanker), allowing them to get away with tanking to save money for a relegation series.

I'm sure there's a few others, but these are the ones that are on the top of my head at the moment.

I think it's also important to highlight that there's two different forms of tanking...

1. Tanking to save money and get relegated at the end of the season.

2. Tanking with the aim of finishing 7th and saving up enough money to buy in mercenaries for a relegation series.

I don't really have much of a problem with #1, as the team demotes at the end of the season, which certainly isn't a reward. I have a big problem with #2 though, as the team (a) gets the benefit of saving a bunch of money; (b) gets to remain in the same division; (c) gets rewarded with a fairly high draft pick; and (d) often causes a team that has been trying to be competitive to demote, because they can't buy in players at the end of the season.

Possible solutions suggested so far...

1. Moving the transfer deadline. This would completely remove all forms of #2 tanking (i.e. tanking to finish 7th), as they would no longer be able to buy in players to help them win a relegation series.

2. Significantly increase the salary floor. This removes some of the financial incentive to tank.

3. Significantly decrease attendances for tanking teams. Again, this reduces the financial incentive to tank, however would require changes to the fan survey code, which is probably more difficult than the first two suggestions.

4. Various fines or penalties for teams that lose by 30+ points, etc. I think we need to be careful here, as it's possible for non-tanking teams to lose a game by 30+ every now and then.

Another option that hasn't been suggested before (to counter type #2 tanking) is to introduce a minimum contract period for players purchased from the transfer list. e.g. a player will have an initial contract of 8 weeks, forcing you to pay a minimum of 8 weeks wages for all players purchased. This doesn't stop teams from buying up a few days before the playoffs, however (although they may have to think twice about it, if they can't sustain the wages for 8 weeks).

Personally, I think suggestion number 1 works the best, as it is the easiest one to implement and it will put an end to type #2 tanking immediately. This could also be looked at together with increasing the salary floor, although don't think a salary floor increase will solve the problem by itself.

I think there is a need to raise the salary floor. But we also have to think about, how this affects the small countrys. As some of their teams might promote with 5k arena, unable to stay on the + side with salary floor too high.
I still think the best way to adress the 7-th spot tanking is to lower game shape to 1 on every transfer. Even 3 300k players with 1 GS can't get you the win against opposite 6-th with home court advantage. If you want better GS you have to keep them on your team and fix their GS, not cheap!
For the fines and penaltys, salary floor should be already the "income correction" enough. I felt attendance drop the more I lost. Every price change time I had to lower the prices. In the end I was making about the same (from arena) I made while having a winning record one div lower.

I still think the best way to adress the 7-th spot tanking is to lower game shape to 1 on every transfer. Even 3 300k players with 1 GS can't get you the win against opposite 6-th with home court advantage. If you want better GS you have to keep them on your team and fix their GS, not cheap!

Why not just change the transfer deadline then?

This penalises all transfers, not just the ones made prior to the relegation series...

This penalises all transfers, not just the ones made prior to the relegation series...

That's the point, penalizing renting a player and daytrading. How hard is it to flip a player with 1 GS?

[2. Because the team has no hope of being competitive in that division anyway.

BB makes incentives for newly promoted teams to be competitive with promotion bonuses and increased attendance, but tanking teams that are newly promoted don't even try to be competitive and instead use this BB help to get even more money from tanking, so they loose, but their attendance don't drop dramatically, they get relegated and after one season they usually get promoted again and they get another bonus.

3. Significantly decrease attendances for tanking teams. Again, this reduces the financial incentive to tank, however would require changes to the fan survey code, which is probably more difficult than the first two suggestions.

There is one problem with this, BB makes incentive for new teams by increasing their attendance what if team actually can't compete and looses games?

I believe in addition of increasing salary floor, BB should increase incentives to win and not to loose - introduce bonuses for won championships and second, third places and so on, I believe someone already wrote about this in this thread. BB will say that this will make winning teams more stronger, but I think this is way is better than to see how teams are competing for the last place.

Last edited by Ghost Master at 5/29/2012 9:45:42 AM