BuzzerBeater Forums

Yo, you guys are some haters
I'm far from being a fan of the Ball hype. If something could shut up LaVar I would buy it, but we should give those kids a far chance to prove themselves. I doubt they will ever live up to the hype their dad and the media created, but I can imagine them having a successful NBA career. Lonzo will get paid next summer, even though not at max level.
LaMelo on the other hand needs some time to develop. I think his ceiling is definitely higher than Lonzo's, but more than every other player he might need the right fit on and off the court. If he is focused on basketball he can become a fun basketball player, even on the defensive end. It needs a lot of work though.
Comparing him to Bennett is not fair. In the mean time he has had more productive games while my guy Wiseman seems to start struggling. No 1 pick Edwards is coming from the bench in a struggling T-wolves team. They all will have their ups and downs this season.
But I can see where the TO's frustration is coming from. You probably expected more from a guy like him. I did too. I never understood why the media tried to hype his time in the NBL. They only looked at the pure numbers in pts, rebs and assists, ignoring the efficiency. I would not have taken him at 3, but maybe at 10. The main reason is, this draft just wasn't very promising.
I'm curious to see if he can prove us doubters wrong. The only thing I'm pretty sure of is that he won't be a HoF and also not a bust.

This has nothing to do with being a hater. It's just a simple fact that a player who was a net negative for his team in a lesser league isn't suddenly going to become a star in the best league in the world. Which, given the draft capital the Hornets spent to acquire him, is what his peak needs to be to not be a bust.

It makes sense to draft tall players based on potential. There aren't that many tall people in the world in general, much less those that like sports enough to put that height to use in basketball. But LaMelo wasn't tall enough to justify taking him on potential. Giannis and Porzingis are the types of players you draft on potential. "Shorter" players have to be drafted on talent, and LaMelo's only talent right now is putting up empty stats so that he looks good on the surface, whilst in reality having horrible plus/minus and not leading his team to wins.

What he did in the NBL is exactly what he's doing in the NBA now. And I still have my doubts regarding how LaMelo will hold up over a full NBA season, because this is the guy who bailed out of a much shorter and less taxing campaign over a sore foot. Obviously he has the potential to improve and become a solid player, everyone who is only 19 does. I just don't think he has the same potential a 7-foot player would to suddenly have a breakout season.

As for Ucan's comments about Europe... I notice that a lot of Euro teams play very deep rotations, making it relatively hard for any one player to stand out as a can't miss prospect, or in the case of older players, someone who should be in the NBA. The scouts therefore have to watch game footage and ultimately make a gut call. To use Doncic as an example;

Doncic 17'-18' (All competitions): 74 GP, 25.1 MPG, 44.9% FG, 30.9% 3PT, 78.8% FT, 14.1 PTS, 5.3 REB, 4.5 AST.
Real Madrid went 64-19 overall and won the Liga ACB + Euroleague.

Doncic was clearly NBA ready and skilled beyond his years, but people expect higher numbers from a 'superstar', and don't expect their team to use them as a sixth man so often (Doncic only started 40 games that season).

I'll admit that LaMelo played really well last night, and I might not have made my previous post had I noticed the result earlier because now it just makes me look stupid. With that being said, it's one great game, and almost anyone in the league can have one great game, just like superstars can occasionally be made to look like scrubs. If LaMelo makes a habit out of having great games, then I'll admit defeat and metaphorically eat shit, but it feels like it would be the work of voodoo magic if this is his normal level of performance, even considering that it's been over a year since I saw him in the NBL.

The point about Euro stats and rotations is that the 'different' way of going about things over there makes American scouts believe they really are smarter. They'll cite reasons like "oh that team knows they'll lose this prospect in the off-season anyway that's why they won't play him" even if such a reason has been proven false. And then the slippery slope of arguments as to why player x didn't shine overseas begins, leading back to scouts being infatuated with potential. And this doesn't just happen in Europe; Greg Oden was infamously drafted ahead of Kevin Durant despite the latter clearly having more talent, even back when Oden was healthy in college.

Europe may lack the dominant superstars that inevitably filter into the NBA, but I daresay that the top clubs over there are almost as strong as the lesser NBA clubs, which are still capable of winning games in the league on a good day. And the game as a whole is better for having such a strong professional second tier of basketball...

First, my apologies if you both took my first line dead serious. It wasn't meant that way. I didn't want to disrespect your opinions. Actually I agree on most of your points. I just don't go along with LaMelo being a 2nd round pick in a rather weak draft. For me he's a late lottery or mid first rounder, but that's just my opinion and I'm far from being an expert. Except for some YouTube videos I didn't see any footage of LaMelo. I read the scouting reports on different websites. I think they were pretty clear about his weaknesses and mostly didn't hype his strengths too much. I was glad he went to Charlotte bc I don't really care about the Hornets. But I like to give all new players a chance before writing them off, no matter what sport we are talking about. We will see if he can live up to his draft position or if he will be a complete bust.
After the first four games I can see him as a rotation guy, surely not a star or even franchise player.

Regarding his NBL season I wouldn't put too much into him leaving the team early. I'm sure he was able to play the rest of the season. Given Ball history that was a business decision like everything else after he left high school. I don't think they ever intended to let him play a full season. They just wanted to increase his draft stock value and unfortunately it worked out for them. I hope both teams, the one in Lithuania and in New Zealand, still got something out of this episode.

For me as someone who is mostly watching NBA and college basketball I can relate to some of the ignorant people. It's hard to compare different talents if you don't have the same level of information on them. Most times the fastest and easiest way is to read the reports in the media and study some stats. Of course, stat fillers like Westbrook & Co always look better than other players that might have a bigger impact on teams' success. Everybody is biased somehow going into the draft.
I wasn't impressed by Luka's pure stats in Europe. At first sight his numbers weren't great compared to what you are used to in the NBA on a daily basis. When you consider the shorter quarters in FIBA basketball and even more his age, it's a different story. Luckily I was also able to watch some of his performances for Real Madrid. After that I was sold on him. It was his presence on the court what impressed me the most. I'm still stunned that he didn't go No 1 in the draft in 2018. I guess the Suns went for the potential and the need of a 7 footer (even though Ayton is 6'11) and the Kings just did what the Kings usually do. The Mavs couldn't be more lucky after trading for the Hawks pick.

I also think it's time to realize 7 footers don't mean more potential. There are too many disappointments in the history, not to forget the injury risk you have to take on. Players like Jokic will always be exceptionally rare. Most 7 footers are either injury prone (like Embiid or Oden) or suck/ are role players at best.
As a Warriors fan I still like the Wiseman pick though ;)

Btw I really hope Hartenstein gets the chance to prove that people were wrong taking Bender over him.

I'll admit that LaMelo played really well last night, and I might not have made my previous post had I noticed the result earlier because now it just makes me look stupid. With that being said, it's one great game, and almost anyone in the league can have one great game, ...

They can have even more than one. Who doesn't remember Linsanity?

Europe may lack the dominant superstars that inevitably filter into the NBA, but I daresay that the top clubs over there are almost as strong as the lesser NBA clubs, which are still capable of winning games in the league on a good day. And the game as a whole is better for having such a strong professional second tier of basketball...

I would like to see the best European teams compete in the NBA on a regular basis. I'm sure many people in the US would be surprised. Although I'm sure it's true most of the times, I don't like that they automatically declare NBA winners to be world champions without even playing a single team outside of the US (the Raptors don't count).

Btw Happy New Year to you guys in Australia!

Looks like LaMelo might silence the bust talk earlier than I thought. For now, he just wrote history when posting a triple double against the Hawks to become the youngest player in the NBA that has done that.
Ok, it was just Atlanta, a team that is struggling the last couple of games and also lost Bogdanovic early in the game. But still, doing this in just over 30 minutes of playing time while being effective, is impressive. He also had the best plus minus.
I'm curious to see if he can back that up, although he already played way better lately anyway.

Blow it up, Atlanta. You're not winning anything with this core if they can't even defend against a stat padding scrub.

Last edited by Jay (OTT) at 1/12/2021 2:24:49 AM