BuzzerBeater Forums

What is a sub level? How can I improve?

Any skill has sublevels. Between any skill you've got like 7 sublevels.

Example: you have a player with a level 3 in rebounds. if you train him one week, you may get 4 sub levels more. He improved, but you don't see it. If you train the same skill this week, you get 4 more sub levels and then you'll see a pop and he'll have a level 4 in rebounds.

There are calculator and toos to help you calculate the trainning, you may find the basics on the red posts. Then, turn to the more specific (and complicated) tools.

Remember to +1 if I helped and don't hesitate to ask, someone will always help. Hope I did help you ;)

thank you very much

Two weeks in a row isn't a big deal, where you get into problems is when you train the same skill for many weeks and the trained skill becomes much, much higher than the others and starts to slow down.

[sorry for offtopic, this is not related to cross-training]

How many levels is much, much higher? Do you have some facts related to this?

This is my experience:
- I trained 2 full seasons in a row rebounding only. Unfortunately training history doesnt show those early pops, but you can be sure that training was not faster than in these trainings which are still visible in my training history.
- Player below was 18 years olds. No other trainings received ever, which means that second highest skill was 7. Difference is between and 4-6. I stopped training after that one, because I had enough information for my study, which was related to lenght of players in rebouding training, not related to this specific topic.

7/1/2011 Rebounding for C / PF
Tero Viisainen ↑popped↑ in Rebounding from sensational to tremendous .
6/24/2011 Rebounding for C / PF
6/17/2011 Rebounding for C / PF
Tero Viisainen ↑popped↑ in Rebounding from prolific to sensational .
6/10/2011 Rebounding for C / PF
Tero Viisainen ↑popped↑ in Rebounding from prominent to prolific .

I have also other example....17 trainings in a row.
I cannot see any big slowdown in a training....and ofcourse this player was 18 years old when training started, other skills max 7.....now he is 19, which should mean that training is a liitle slower due to age, not due to high skills.

11/18/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from prolific to sensational .
11/11/2011 One on One for PG / SG
11/4/2011 One on One for PG / SG
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Jump Shot from proficient to prominent .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from prominent to prolific .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from sensational to tremendous .
10/28/2011 One on One for PG / SG
10/21/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from prolific to sensational .
10/14/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Jump Shot from strong to proficient .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from proficient to prominent .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Inside Shot from strong to proficient .
10/7/2011 One on One for PG / SG
9/30/2011 One on One for PG / SG
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from strong to proficient .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from prominent to prolific .
9/23/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Jump Shot from respectable to strong .
9/16/2011 One on One for PG / SG
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from proficient to prominent .
9/9/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from respectable to strong .
9/2/2011 One on One for PG / SG
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Jump Shot from average to respectable .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from strong to proficient .
8/26/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from average to respectable .
8/19/2011 One on One for Forwards
8/12/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from respectable to strong .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Inside Shot from respectable to strong .
8/5/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Jump Shot from mediocre to average .
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Handling from mediocre to average .
7/29/2011 One on One for Forwards
Delio Falzano ↑popped↑ in Driving from average to respectable .


So my point is: training one skill quite long time doesn't slow down the speed. Ofcourse you do not receive any elastic effect boost to your training, but I could not state that training is slowing down....

I hope you can show me that I'm totally wrong again


Last edited by Codemasters at 12/14/2011 5:47:40 AM

Perhaps what he meant is that if you don't get any elastic efect, trainning is lower, because it will take more time to improve other skills. So, from my point of view, it's slower. ;)

Hello!
We have a 21 years old player in our national database with 5 pops in last friday´s training.
Training: 1x1 (forwards).

Pops:
JS (natural pop)
HD (natural pop)
DR (natural pop)
IS (natural pop)
ID (cross training)

It is the first time i see something like this.
I guess that this is the best training possible in number of pops achieved under the new cross training system.


Here it is:
Lançamento: extraordinário ↑ Dist. de Lanç.: impressionante
Def. Exterior: extraordinário Drible: admirável ↑
Penetração: admirável ↑ Passe: impressionante
Lanç. Interior: comum ↑ Def. Interior: comum ↑
Ressalto: tenebroso Desarme Lanç.: respeitável
Resistência: medíocre Lance Livre: medíocre

Experiência: tenebroso



Best regards,
nasantos, Portugal U21 coach

Perhaps what he meant is that if you don't get any elastic efect, trainning is lower, because it will take more time to improve other skills. So, from my point of view, it's slower. ;)

You might be right. My interpretation was different from the post.....
I tried to re-read that post:

Two weeks in a row isn't a big deal, where you get into problems is when you train the same skill for many weeks and the trained skill becomes much, much higher than the others and starts to slow down.

But lets see if someone has examples where training of highest skills starts to slow down....

ahhhhhhhhhhhh, now I get your point.

I can't tell you that. What I do know is that monoskilled players raise salary very quickly. ;)

There have been some slowdown issues reported on young NT hopefuls, and elsewhere in the forums. Here's a fine example from Astragoth: (199625.32)

So by "much, much higher," I meant a lot bigger difference than 6-7 levels. For instance, the player linked above has OD skill 11 levels higher than his passing skill, and 16 levels higher than his SB skill.

Going back to the season 17 news post:

With cross-training, these new techniques emphasize each skill as part of becoming a more complete basketball player, and make reference to every skill. Thus, improvement in driving is related not just to related skills (like handling), but also more weakly to unrelated skills (like shot blocking). For the average player in the game, this will result in approximately 10% slower training in their primary skill than before, and additional training in other skills approximately corresponding to that 10% loss. A particularly well-rounded player will continue to receive cross-training but will see a much lower reduction in primary skill training, while a particularly one-dimensional player will see a larger loss. Although players will always receive a set amount of cross-training, it is difficult to predict which unrelated skills will improve on a weekly basis.

Thanks. That is good example and player is not even monoskilled! Other skills at level 11 (JS, JR) and handling even higher. OD was 17 and training that skill seems to take much longer than expected. I hate CT, even though I think all skills are important for all players.....

There have been some slowdown issues reported on young NT hopefuls, and elsewhere in the forums. Here's a fine example from Astragoth: (199625.32)

Elastic effect. My then 22y old was popping just fine from 13 to 14 and from 14 to 15 in OD; pop every two weeks. However, he had DR 14 and HA 13.

Then again, for the first time in his "career", my U21 player needed 3 weeks for OD to pop (14 to 15). His DR and HA are both 13. But except for ID, he has low inside skills so maybe CT was bringing that down a bit. If CT had such a great effect like you are claiming to have from this example, my player should employ at least 4 weeks to pop in OD - and that's not the case.

Last edited by Koperboy at 12/16/2011 5:45:19 AM