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This is managerial game and I think manager should take responsibility how players will play. In that sense I think removing advantage for empty line up, both minutes and performance wise is very good.
Looking forward for this change!
Must wait for next PL to test it...

I have never looked at the game this way. I have looked at the game from the economic/training/management viewpoint. The actual managing of the actual game is horrible. You have next to no control. You do have control over your team economics and training if you like but in game control doesn't exist. I love the pick an inside offense for game day but you are down by four in the closing minutes and start launching threes even though you have almost no shot at making them since there is an outside shooting penalty associated with an inside offense. You can't make an in game decision to run an outside offense. Why? Because you already have a coach. We as users aren't the coach. I like the blank lineup. I use partial blank for training. I couldn't imagine trying to train and be remotely competitive in USA d2 without it. I won't ever be a three trainee 48+ per week guy. The blank lineup is by far the most realistic feature of the game day management and BB wants to take it away? Unrealistic is playing guys 48+. Unrealistic is having to manage your superstas minutes to under 72 in a week to manage form. Realistic is having a rotation in constant flow managing the effective levels of players on the floor. Have you ever seen a game where the coach pulls the whole starting five at the five minute mark in the fourth quarter and reinserts them three minutes later? That's Strictly Follow Depth Chart and that is strictly stupid. If peoe want to manage their team that way, have at it. It's robotic and ridiculous. Don't take the best part (the only working part) of the in game management away. Forcing teams to have 10 or 12 man rotations to balance minutes is going to kill the expensive national team guys. Who will be able to afford those guys if they have to carry two or three more with significant salary so they will sub in the game. Not well thought out with zero feedback from the people. Might be a turning point in this three plus year supporters run.

Perhaps the Game Code should be adjusted so that some players can be forced to play 48 minutes barring injury or foul out...no matter the situation. I would predict that nearly everyone would prefer this method. Maybe have a player or two designated for this each game.

Secondly, perhaps the game code could be adjusted so that SFDC looks for optimum times to sub in/out players instead of doing several subouts of starters at the same time. This is by far the worst part of SFDC. Its having a lineup of losers in the game at the same time thereby forcing bad shot selection.

As is there is a very significant advantage to using BL/LDC. Marin's proposal is to limit the effectiveness by 40% or so in comparison to Set Lineup/SFDC. My biggest complaint is that knowing about this option is not very intuitive. If there are changes significantly effecting lineups it should be explained in the guide and its effectiveness in comparison to setting a lineup.

It's about sacrifices. This entire game is about sacrifices. How much of a sacrifice do you make to train your own players. A lot if you single position three, considerably less if you do two, and none at all if you don't train. To me game shape training is way more over powered than BL, but I am fine with it because owners that utilize it sacrifice somewhere else. Most complaints in this forum are about things that don't benefit the complainer. Unless the other options for substitutions are fixed, the robotic options just won't be appealing to me. Of all the things that could use a tune up on this game, this seems to be the one that didn't need it. If it is to help people that train, I train just fine using it, but I sacrifice by not having a real third trainee. I don't want to spend a significant portion of my payroll on 10th or 11th guys on the roster. Did anyone even consider the TL ramifications of this? This all seems extremely half assed.

I agree that possibilities to control games is very poor. However I still think that there should not be remarkable benefits in performance by using empty lineups. There are also some other options than lets coach decide and strictly follow depth chart, which I have used a lot

The point is the "remarkable benefits" come with sacrifice. Just the same with game shape training which I think has more substantial returns than a blank lineup. If you are willing to make the sacrifice, why shouldn't it be an option?

Two things:
First:
By studying the Game Manual, or simply by using best judgement, blank lineup is the logical way to set the lineup with the option Let Coach Decide. It says " entirely the coach's judgment".
When filling the depth chart with players, there´s a logical option to choose: Coach Picks From Depth Chart.

Second:
On the News Page, it still says that the "new" engine is tested in Private League Games, while this is being delayed in the meantime. An announcement solely made in THIS thread surely doesn´t address the majority of the users.

I agree with the change. Like it or not...the game now has only 26,000 users. They need to do something to make it more enjoyable and the way to do that is by making it more challenging. I thought it(blank line ups) were a glitch from the start. To me it is the BB's taking out the trash.

Obviously, this thread has moved from a new feature feedback thread to a discussion on whether this should even be implemented, even though I've warned against this. I'm not happy about most of the posts here as they are neither on topic nor constructive. I have refrained from deleting them because I do want to hear what our users have to say, but my patience has reached a limit and I will not tolerate such posts any more. This is a direct warning.

Let me be clear right away and reiterate: blank lineup will be dealt with, one way or another. The current plan is to, as a first step, test the BL prevention code in the GE, which will be tested again this Friday, until it is perfected. Second, we will consider implementing a stamina effect in the game shape calculation code for training to offset the possible loss of game shape due to "forced" lineups. We might even think of some other measures in the meantime. Then, we will implement the empty lineup prevention code when it's ready for all match types along with the countermeasures.

Since the offseason processing is starting today, I will need to concentrate on that for a couple of days and will therefore have very limited time to post here. Therefore, I urge you to behave, stay on topic and be more constructive with your comments in the meantime. Thank you.

EDIT:

Thank you Westri for the clarification. I deleted my below message to keep us on topic after gaining the understanding that:

1. I can still submit an empty lineup for PL games.
2. Instead of the GE choosing which players to start and substitute, the coach will now fill in a lineup before the GE starts processing the game.


Last edited by Michael Wolf at 7/7/2014 4:27:18 PM