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Toch even reageren:

Het is inderdaad leuk om te beseffen dat men de energie die het huidige team in het U21/NT steekt, weet te appreciëren. Het is echter nu eenmaal het spel dat men telkenmale om de 2 seizoenen een nieuwe nationale coach kiest en dat deze totaal vrij is eigen team mee te brengen (het is niet omdat CP3C een zuiderbuur van ons is... het kan even goed dat een belgische coach zijn eigen team meebrengt). Het is positief dat iedereen zijn kans krijgt om ook van dat aspect van BB te 'genieten'. Ik heb er totaal geen probleem mee om dan ook desnoods de fakkel door te geven en onze info ivm mogelijke kandidaatjes voor het U21 te overhandigen aan de nieuwe U21 coach.

Net zoals we niemand kunnen verplichten om een speler op te trainen voor het U21 (een manager blijft altijd heer en meester over zijn eigen ploeg en neemt zelf de beslissing), kunnen we ook een nieuwe U21/NT coach geen medewerkers opleggen.
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It's good to know people appreciate the work done by the whole U21/NT crew. However ... it's a rule every 2 season a new U21 coach is appointed. He is totaly free to bring his own crew (it's not because CP3C is a southern neighbour... a belgian manager can bring indeed his own team too). It's not bad every-one get the opportunity to enjoy this extra aspect in playing BB. I really don't have any problem with passing the torch and the info to our next new U21 coach crew.

as, in the same way, we can not force someone to train some player for U21 (a manager has to take this decission himself), we can't force a new U21-coach to accept former crewmembers.

Last edited by AnGi77 at 5/19/2012 3:17:39 PM

First of all, I think there's no 'perfect' player for a position, to give you an easy example, a Power Foward, who's less strong inside, but strong inside, can have a bigger role then a decent outside players who's extremely dominant inside.
But my ultimate PG would be a player with good passing, ballhandling, jump range, a decent jump shot but most importantly, amazing outside defence and good free throws, since the ball is going to be in his hands when the game is close. It doesn't hurt if a point gaurd has got a bit of inside scoring and good driving.
For SG's, I got the same requirements, defense is important, because the old quote is as much true as it has always been... Defense wins games! and ofcourse jump shot, jump range are primary aspects, but ballhandling and passing can not be overlooked! Because a SG who can play PG at times, can always be useful (If the PG's have trouble with their game shape!)
Further, a good SF to me is a guy, who is as good inside as he is outside! Both inside and outside defense are priorities! Furthermore a decent jump shot and inside scoring are required... Ballhandling, passing and rebounding should be above level 6-7 and driving should be 7-8.
For PF's, I allready made a certain point, they also need to be able to contribute when the team is playing Motion or Run 'n Gun! Because that can create missmatches among the opposing team... They should also be strong inside, defense offense and rebounding... But I think an aspect which is often forgotten is the fact that they should also have a little outside defense, so they can play SF when you're playing Look Inside, but still need to have a guy who can defend the opposing 3. They should be well-rounded players. This is not always the case in U21 teams, since the first years of training are focussed inside. But that's something I really aim to succeed in my time as an U21 coach, I want to have a 'standard' how for example PF's can be or should be built!
And finally, the C's... Centers should be monstrous inside, really having good rebounding and defensive skills, inside scoring is important, but less important than the previous aspects. They should also have a little ballhandling and passing, since turnovers can really destroy a game!
Ofcourse, this is my vision of players and those closest to my expectations, wil have a spot on the roster.

I want to close this argument, by stating that defense is the most important aspect to me, because my experience in the game proved me that defense wins championships. So I'd rather have a great defense and a decent offense then having a good defense and a good offense!

And ofcourse, we can't force managers, to train the players the way we want them to... But we can help those, who ask themselves how to build their training schedule and so on...

Last edited by Laur3ns at 5/19/2012 1:28:49 PM

Well, when someone doesn't want to train a players for the U21 despite that player being a great prospect, you can always convince them to sell him... Because those talents, are worth a fair penny! Then we got a win-win situation... For example, I bought a player who was a prospect, but not really getting trained by his owner... I payed 500 000k for him, situations like those, can really open up the eyes of the manager :)

Pour l'instant je n'ai aucun staff, j'en construirais un après l'élection.
Si des managers déjà présents dans l'ancien staff veulent poursuivre leur boulot, je suis ouvert à toutes propositions.
Sinon j'ai quand même quelques connaissances qui seront ravis de m'aider.

For now I have no staff, I would build one after the election.
If managers are already present in the former staff want to continue their work, I'm open to offers.
Otherwise I do have some knowledge that will be happy to help me.

Voor nu heb ik geen personeel, zou ik een bouwen na de verkiezingen.
Als spelers al aanwezig in de voormalige medewerkers willen hun werk voort te zetten, ik sta open voor aanbiedingen.
Anders Ik heb wel enige kennis die u graag om me te helpen.

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Concernant l'entraînement des U21, je contacterais les joueurs pour savoir l'entraînement prévu. Après on pourra parler de ce qui pourrais aider l'équipe nationale. Par la suite si le joueur ne veut pas former pour les U21, alors tant pis son joueur pourra quand même être utile pour l'équipe.

For training the U21, I mail the players to know the training required. Then we can talk about what could help the national team. Thereafter if the player does not train for the U21, so too bad his players can still be useful for the team.

Voor de training van de U21, ik raak de spelers om te weten de opleiding vereist. Dan kunnen we praten over wat kan het nationale team te helpen. Daarna als de speler niet trainen voor de U21, zo jammer dat zijn spelers nog steeds nuttig zijn voor het team.

J'ai une question pour les candidats.

Utiliseriez-vous le même type de joueurs intérieurs pour une tactique extérieure qu'intérieure ? Si non, quel profil seriez-vous le plus à même d'utiliser et dans quel cas ?

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I have a question for both candidates.

Would you be using the same type of inside players for an outside tactic or an inside one ? If not, which player profile would you rather be using in which case ?

I would use different players, it starts with the PF and SF position. The center to me, is the center in the best shape (with the best stats) important for the center though, with an outside play, is that he is a great rebounder, since you will get less rebounds by other players. The PF position will be taken by a PF/SF or C who has got a decent/good jump shot and also some outside defense (depends whether you're facing a team which attacks outside). Same for the SF position, it depends on the skillset!
For an inside play, I would dare to put 2 inside forces on the PF/C slots and a power foward or SF on the 3-spot. Because outside defense will be an issue when you play with 3 centers at those 3 positions. This place can both be taken by an outside oriënted PF (With a good jump shot and some outside defense) or a SF who can score and defend inside.
My personal opinion is that you can not neglect outside play when you go inside, or vice versa!

Pour moi quoi qu'il en soit j'utiliserais toujours un C avec beaucoup de rebond. Si on domine le rebond nous enlevons des chances à l'adversaire de marquer et en attaque on peut avoir des secondes chance.

Si on joue avec un système intérieur j'utiliserais un C un peu "bourrin" sur les primaires sans trop compter sur ses secondaires. J'utiliserais un PF avec peut-être moins de primaires mais un peu de passe et de jump shot.

Ensuite si on joue sur un système extérieur, j'opterais toujours pour un C avec beaucoup de rebond pour récupérer les shoots manqués des extérieurs. Ensuite pas mal de shoot intérieur pour marquer derrière les rebonds, c'est assez important. Ensuite avoir pas mal de passe est un facteur important aussi pour un C qui peut ressortir plus facilement sur ses extérieurs après un rebond.
Pour le PF, je vois avec de bonnes primaires mais aussi beaucoup de secondaires. De la passe comme expliqué pour le C, du dribble et de l'agilité mais aussi du jump shot. Bref le PF doit être assez complet sur les systèmes extérieur.

Je ne parle pas de la DI qui doit être très haute pour les deux postes sur n'importe quel système.

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For me anyway I'd use a C always with great rebound. If you dominate the rebound we remove opportunities for the opponent to score on offense and you can have second chance.

If you play an inside system I would use a C with great primaries without count on his side. I would use a PF with perhaps less primary but a few passes and jump shot.

Then if you play on an outside system, I would opt for a C always with a lot of rebound to retrieve missed shots from outside. Then a lot of shoot to mark inside behind the bounces, it is quite important. Then have a lot of passes is also an important factor for a C that can come out more easily on its outside after a rebound.
For the PF, I see with good primary but also many secondary. Some passes as explained for the C, of dribbling and agility but also the jump shot. In short, the PF should be fairly complete on systems outside.

I'm not talking about the DI to be very high for both positions on any system.

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Voor mij toch zou ik gebruik maken van een C altijd met veel rebound. Als u domineren de rebound verwijderen we kansen voor de tegenstander te scoren in de aanval en je kunt tweede kans hebben.

Als u een systeem dat ik zou gebruik maken van een C in een beetje "zeuren" op de voorverkiezingen zonder rekenen op zijn zijde. Ik zou gebruik maken van een PF met misschien minder primaire maar een paar passen en spring schot.

Als je dan spelen op een extern systeem, dan zou ik altijd kiezen voor een C met veel bounce tot gemiste schoten van buiten te halen. Dan is een heleboel te schieten van het interieur te markeren achter de bounces, is het heel belangrijk is. Dan is een veel passes hebben is ook een belangrijke factor voor een C die naar buiten komen gemakkelijker op de buitenkant na een rebound.
Om de PF, zie ik met goede primaire, maar ook vele secundaire. Het wachtwoord zoals beschreven voor de C, dribbelen en behendigheid, maar ook de jump shot. Kortom, de PF vrij volledig op systemen buiten.

Ik heb het niet over de verdediging naar binnen om zeer hoog te zijn voor beide posities op elk systeem.

Hi CP3C, and Laur3ns,

First off, you guys are two very strong candidates,

CP3C, first, if you would win the elections, I would propose that you'll let someone else take the word for you, someone who speaks at least English correctly (NO OFFENCE MEANT). But it is kind of annoying when you read a text that says something different then the original e.g. (216984.12) at the end you said that the ID must be high in all cases, translated in Dutch (although it was a sentence with many grammar mistakes) it said that the defense didn't had to be really high.

Then, that fact about the staff, I think it is very "brave" of you to say that you will do a lot of work, BUT, you cannot do all the work, the scouting and the contact with the manager who own the prospect isn't a job for you. You have staff for that. You "just"have to maintain contact with the scouts, and maybe follow a top prospect.
The head of scouting is Angi, and I think she wants to continue as Head of scouting (Correct me if I am wrong Angi ;) ).

Aside of those points, I think that you would be a top manager for the next seasons

That's about it for you, CP3C :)

Now Laur3ns,
personally, I agree more wih your view of how to train the players then CP3C's,
but I think your strategy is more something for elder players then for 21 YO.
The SF and PF are quite hard to train other then the C, who are quite easy to train.
And if I am correct your trump card is the mis-match between our SF,PF and the opponents SF/PF.
If you'd try to become the NT manager I would sure vote for you, because your vision is very correct and good,
but not for younger players. I still don't know wich one of you is the best match for the post, but I'lll think about it.

You would sure be a enrichment for the staff, but maybe also a top U21-manager

That is all folks :p

Grtz
!ngkor

Last edited by !ngkor at 5/21/2012 11:35:19 AM

Thanks Ingkor,

But for me to put a line up in the way I invision it... Are plans for the future! Because I really want to focus on the next few seasons. This season is going to be extremely hard for the U21, either if CP3C gets the job, or me. The group that the Belgian U21 is in, is very tough!
But if I get the coaching job, I would gather the scouts and try to find guidelines for managers to help them train their players. In this way, I want to make sure that we're able to have a good team each year.
And you're probably right, SF and PF are going to be tough positions. First off all because of the all around stats which I want. But also because those positions do not get 'solo' trained alot. So that's why the U21 needs dedicated managers, who will train their player, to improve the U21, before improving their own team. And as a U21 coach or scout, it's impossible to force that upon a manager. So you're probably right about that!

CP3C, first, if you would win the elections, I would propose that you'll let someone else take the word for you, someone who speaks at least English correctly (NO OFFENCE MEANT). But it is kind of annoying when you read a text that says something different then the original e.g. (216984.12) at the end you said that the ID must be high in all cases, translated in Dutch (although it was a sentence with many grammar mistakes) it said that the defense didn't had to be really high.

I must say... indeed it is correct the dutch translation isn't the way it should be... but it also shows us this manager is motivated and willing to communicate with the whole belgian community, which we sure all appreciate. I imagine dutch can be very difficult as the position of words in sentences is totaly different from the french way.

The head of scouting is Angi, and I think she wants to continue as Head of scouting (Correct me if I am wrong Angi ;)

I would like to make some note: it's for sure I like the job of scouting (I always liked to train yougnsters, it fits me more then all these 'tactical' choices to be made).... As the scouting team was renewed some season ago, it was good to have a senior scout to give some guidance to the new scouts at that point . But I'm sure the actual team is now doiing a great job and some of them can surely take over. For sure I'm always available to help our new coach as scout... but as it comes to making his team, he's totaly free to appoint his own U21-crew. I'm surely aware this is an aspect of our BB-game that should be 'open' to every motivated manager.

@ !ngkor
I wouldn't judge on the translations it's the point of view that is very intresting.
Ok his dutch isn't what it should be but you can say the same thing about my french and that is even worse then his dutch :)
Also it's good he hasn't a team around him yet you never know who's gonna win and yes it is difficult
Those are my 5cents :)

further more I'm in doubt who to select but I must make a choice.

Gtrs
SnoobS