BuzzerBeater Forums

I didn't think you would suddenly get it, but that's okay. carry on.

Mike your big assumption is that building a large arena in say DIV with empty seats is like burning money which is just not true. The managers that truly understand how the BB economy works, knows that you need to do two things before you promote to the next division: 1) Have your arena up to standards the higher division and 2) create a core of players needed to not only promote but be able to keep you from relegating.

While it may seem counter-intuitive to build an arena in DIV that may not sell seats but it is an economically sound decision. If you promote to DIII with a small arena, your opportunity cost is giving up all of the money that you could have been making once you promoted to DIII with the bigger arena. Basically, you do not maximize the promotion attendance bonus if you don't have a big arena when you promote. You will never be able to recoup the lost money, you could have been earning. In DIII, you can sellout a 20k arena so it makes sense to build a 20k arena in DIV.

As wolph stated above, this game does not reward you for almost winning. Building an arena makes a lot of sense before buying the players you need to promote. The opportunity cost of buying a player on the TL, is that you lose the cash you could have been making every week on their salary.

The only exception I would have would be to spend money on a trainees before building the arena. Arena building time is a terrific opportunity to train while you are not really focused on promoting. But unless you are spending money on top tier trainees, you aren't really going to spend more than a couple 100k on trainees. With proper planning, you finish arena building, get your trainees to the point that they can compete in the higher division, and have the cash to buy the players you need on the TL all around the same time.

Phyr, thanks for your message. I agree with most of it.

However, "your big assumption is that building a large arena in say DIV with empty seats is like burning money " completely misstates what I am saying. Wolph insists that building as big and as fast as possible is the way to go. He insists there is no cost for that. Those are opinions I have questioned, as they clearly do not take into account the opportunity cost of building empty seats.

Your example of an opportunity cost related to promoting with too small an arena is reasonable, but it is not the only opportunity cost in play.

Thank you.

Bulls eye :)

One think im lacking is an arena where we see someone that has built and are sitting on a lot of empty seats. And for it to be a really good example it would also need to be at minimum prices.

I'm currently experiencing that with my lower tier, but after an 0-22 season and demotion that's not entirely unexpected. Even then, you can see the last few games of last season I was still selling every one of those seats. Courtside and luxury boxes are still doing pretty well, too - I actually undershot my pricing on courtside quite a bit, and I'm a little surprised I don't sell even fewer luxury boxes.

I of course also underestimated how much easier it is to be competitive in III now than it was when I was coming up. I still haven't gotten up to the salary floor yet and still managed to win one game and other than my first game, I've been within 6 points in the final minute every other game. I know I'm not getting everyone's best effort either, but I was expecting another 0-22 season and now I think I might have an outside chance of avoiding demotion to IV.

On the general issues being discussed, today's money matters, tomorrow's money matters, and you've got to know what you're going to do. While I'm fond of investing in the arena, I think the real key advice I'd give to anyone listening is that the best thing you can do is try to learn how to compete with lower salaries than your opponents. If you can do that, when you can get your arena built up you'll be able to be even more successful when you can afford the same or greater salaries. Alternately, you need a plan to be able to afford to outspend your opponents all the time, which gets harder the higher you go.

I don't know. I'm still getting my head around how someone can promote, make playoffs in the first season at that level, then demote the next season and still support the idea of "opportunity cost" as a good thing. Sounds like the perfect example of how much opportunity costs when you don't have the infrastructure behind you to me.

Last edited by Perriwinkle Blue at 8/27/2015 8:01:50 PM

I don't know. I'm still getting my head around how someone can promote, make playoffs in the first season at that level, then demote the next season and still support the idea of "opportunity cost" as a good thing.

Try again. No one says opportunity cost is a "good" thing. All I've done is try to explain it to some people who obviously don't understand it. Add one more to the list, eh?

Last edited by Mike Franks at 8/27/2015 9:20:17 PM

No one says opportunity cost is a "good" thing. All I've done is try to explain it to some people who obviously don't understand it. Add one more to the list, eh?

You sound like a kid who learned a cool concept in school and now tries to apply it so you sound like you know what you are talking about...LOL Even though, the concept is largely outdated, and/or a minor part of the overall topic or issue.

And before you attack me as being ignorant about the concept or anything silly like that...I was a Stock Broker for 6 years...so i know all of the cool economic terms and principles too LOL

So then maybe a GM who claims to understand it ought to help others instead of making such a silly post trying to mock me, eh?

So then maybe a GM who claims to understand it ought to help others instead of making such a silly post trying to mock me, eh?

I think I have made it I clear I believe you are clueless.