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I think what some people are missing is that your record is not the strongest factor in ticket sales.

It is your opponent and how strong they are.

What is silly to me is, a guy giving out 25-0's all seaosn gets anywhere close to full revenue. The prize for moving up a divison should be that you have the CHANCE to compete from revenues. NOT being GUARANTEED more revenue.

The way the game is now just glosses over farm teams. A guy moves up, dumps his good players, buys draftees and runs them the whole season while collecting first division revenue. And when i guy that is trying losses a tough game to a superior team, we face a penalty in the next games ticket sales.

Why should a guy consistantly losing by 75 points (or worse 0-25 every game) have an even remote chance of matching my revenues when im putting a legit team on the floor?

This game doesnt adjust well from ticket sales in corellation with will loss record.

Two losses in a row affect your ticket sales more than 6 wins in a row...especially losses on Saturday.

Nothing is more irritating than going into a game you 100% know the other team is using for training and they benefit from the popularity of your team...yet when they come to your arena, you do not benefit.

Why should a weaker team make more for me going to their arena than i make from them coming to mine?

You lose a game 0-25, or by 50+ points it should hit you. You lose 2/3 or more, it should hit you hard...and for the rest of the season.

Farm teams with 200k in salary stacking money because they are in the top divisions without even trying to win for a season. These teams should NEVER see 400k in a home game, much less 500k.

Um, how do I put this(?) no, you didn't explicitly say such a thing, or implicitly for that matter, but if you wanna think about it for a second, it is really not what you said as much it is what you didn't say.
You see, to me, tanking and his two 5th places, one season after another, are inseparable; to you, those two have nothing in common apparently. You kept saying how the guy didn't tank but one game last season, where you know yourself - unless you're, as I already said in that other post, really naive or more likely, in some kind of relationship with the man in question - that it is close to impossible to do what he did without intentionally losing throughout the season. Do you understand now what I'm talking about?

Second thing, when your mind is "certainly open to debate", why not talk about current season a bit? Tell me, how many times did he tanked this season, you think? Once? Twice? Three times? And that is not relevant to our conversation? Or if it is, then why are you keep skipping on that part(?) you know, you being objective and all :-) Perhaps his statistic from this season don't speak in favor of what you're trying to pitch?

Third thing, I'm well aware of existence of other teams who do the same thing, so there is really no reason for you to bring them into the conversation when I'm really trying to discuss Edju.
Yes, I know about Heatcoatmen, and yes, I agree, his case is even more absurd; but I already addressed that in one of my previous posts, didn't I? So, why do you talk about him again?
Yes, I know about Jason - I play in that league, you know; I know who my leaguemates are and what they do - and yes, I agree, he should be penalized for it, too; but again, what does he have to do with the point I'm trying to make about Edju?
Do you see where I'm going at with this? Does this help you to see why I said what I said in that last post of mine?

I just wasted another half an hour of my life, didn't I :-)

I rest my case.

Listen, you don't strike me as someone who is unfair, and for what it's worth, I respect your opinion - I even said how I usually agree with you in that first post I wrote - but you're clearly defending the system right now, that being intentionally or not. Not so much in this particular post - actually, judging by this one, I would say you're on my side :-) - but definitely in the earlier ones.

Edit:
And just for the record, I wasn't screaming "I got robbed!". I was just offering my two cents to an ongoing discussion. Similarly, I have no problem with Edju. He was used purely as an example.

Last edited by Mr. Hyde at 12/6/2011 3:35:43 AM

I think getting the fifth spot is not tanking. Managers sometimes need to lose a game on purpose to be able to keep themselves in the cup or manage game shape for a chance to win the next game. If you manage to pull out fifth spot you actually have a team that is able to compete. Don't you agree?
About the walkovers. I think walkover should be any game, that has less than five players in lineup. It's unreal to just pick fans from attendance to be your starters. I can understand, that perhaps the GE needs a spot filler and can't run with 4 vs 5 simulation, but that should only happen if someone get's injured, ejected or fouled out. Sure you can suit up one injured player and have him limp off after the game starts, but I prefer 5 healthy players start the game rule.
After every walkover, the club not coming to compete should get fined by the league by a sum equal to player salary floor. This way they can collect their income and pay atleast some of it away as fines. League player salary floor should be somewhat raised. I think the negative effects of a team tanking and relegating, negates his one seasonal income as a higher league team.

Last edited by Kukoc at 12/6/2011 4:47:51 AM

And just for the record, I wasn't screaming "I got robbed!".

This wasn't directed to you, but to the OP. Thanks for respecting my opinion, I try to be fair as much as possible

I'm going to ignore the first two paragraphs, as they're little more than sarcasm and innuendo.

I'm well aware of existence of other teams who do the same thing, so there is really no reason for you to bring them into the conversation when I'm really trying to discuss Edju.
Yes, I know about Heatcoatmen, and yes, I agree, his case is even more absurd; but I already addressed that in one of my previous posts, didn't I? So, why do you talk about him again?
Yes, I know about Jason - I play in that league, you know; I know who my leaguemates are and what they do - and yes, I agree, he should be penalized for it, too; but again, what does he have to do with the point I'm trying to make about Edju? Yes, I know about Jason - I play in that league, you know; I know who my leaguemates are and what they do - and yes, I agree, he should be penalized for it, too; but again, what does he have to do with the point I'm trying to make about Edju?
Do you see where I'm going at with this? Does this help you to see why I said what I said in that last post of mine?

I brought up Heathcoat and Jason to show what I see as the true definition of tanking. I could have searched through other leagues to find another tanking team, but his was the most readily available choice. Jason's ultimate goal is to stockpile money and a high draft pick through relegation, while Edju's primary goal seems to be to avoid both the playoffs and relegation series through a fifth place finish.

You'd like to lump these two forms of losing together, that's fine. I see a key difference, and they both highlight different problems with the current setup of the game. First: teams trying to relegate, like Jason is currently, make way too much money because the salary floor is too low. Second: savvy users like Edju can throw their home matches, win their away games and still make a lot of revenue through attendance.

Raising the salary floor and tweaking the attendance formula would fix both of these issues. To some extent.





Last edited by Arthur Monay at 12/6/2011 6:48:44 PM

Those are 2 good posts, Wolph. I could only plus the 1st.

There are plenty of problems with the economics of this game. 11 home games to 12 financial updates every season, away games affect on the following game, the ability to successfully tank, making less money in the 3rd game of the finals series because you lost the 2nd on the road (i know that falls into a previously stated category but it pisses me off), the salaries of the best players in the game, etc...

There is a reason why the transfer list has degraded into the crap hole that it is. Obviously we have problems with the economy of this game. Most people can see this. However, there is a reason why things won't change...the BB's are arrogant enough to think things are perfect and that nothing is currently wrong with the economic state of this game or with how teams make/lose money in certain situations. It's idiotic, but it won't change. It's a pity...