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This Post:
22
270734.98 in reply to 270734.97
Date: 6/4/2015 7:48:14 AM
TrenseRI
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
36003600
Second Team:
ChiLeaders
Training is a long term team development strategy that requires skill, determination and time. It can be done by everyone, even by managers which can log in only a couple of times per week. Trading is requires almost no skill and needs much less time and determination. Managers which have lots of time to scour the transfer list and bid a lot definitely have the advantage here. There needs to be a balance between these manager types, with the advantage of one type being met with the payback for long term persistence of the other. This is the main reason why training should be more important than trading. Otherwise most casual players would find themselves swallowed up, hence losing interest.
So, do we like high TL prices? Yes, they directly motivate training.

I admit now that the newspost is partly misleading and should have been written better. It was a mistake on my part and I stand by it, because I'm only human and not being a native speaker definitely didn't help. The accusations that this was intentional and part of some deception and a conspiracy don't even garner a response from me. I should have mentioned that the free agent numbers will dwindle across the board with the exception of very young ones, which are making their debuts. The responsibility for the misunderstanding is mine alone.

Let's move on from the semantics now and talk about constructive improvements. Is this the final version of the FA formula? Probably not. We will reassess the effect it had and check if it was positive or negative (for the game, not the managers and their wishes), and maybe change it as soon as next season. A change is not guaranteed, and even if it is made, there's no guarantee you will like it.

I'll try to give a couple of resposes to specific questions/opinions here, but bear with me because there's a LOT of them and my time is limited.

It seems to me that young players need very high potential and decent skills to finish up as a free agent, and older guys (23-28) have to be multiskilled to have a try at a free agency.

So going with this theory, 24y MVP center with 120k salary will retire beucase his guard skills are at a very low level and he doesn't match the multiskill criteria to become a free agent.
Yes, this is true. We have no intention to save every valuable player. It has been explained why in my previous posts. Also, using TSP instead of salary shift favours multiskilled and/or outside players at the expense of inside players. This is intentional and is something we are aware of and is not a bad thing, in my view, especially considering the current situation with the inside dominance. The inside dominance was definitely brought on largely by the low prices and high availability of inside players, so it makes sense to do changes which offset that. However, since the overall impact of free agency is limited, and within it, this shift toward multiskilled players has an even smaller impact, the change will need some time to become palpable.

I think the problem many users have with this is that it creates inflation. Based on your post, you seem to want this as it will encourage more managers to train.
...
If every user focused on training, there would be such an abundant supply of players that most would be practically worthless. Only very salary efficient, highly skilled players would be of any significant worth.
Training should be encouraged, as I've explained why above. Thinking that everyone will focus on training because of a FA rule change is extreme exaggeration. We are not dealing in absolutes here, but in factors that shift the balance one way or another.

Continues in the next post...

Last edited by BB-Marin at 6/4/2015 7:51:05 AM

This Post:
22
270734.99 in reply to 270734.98
Date: 6/4/2015 7:49:56 AM
TrenseRI
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
36003600
Second Team:
ChiLeaders
...
Where there used to be balance in building a roster through drafting/training AND the transfer list, now we're going to have to build our rosters mainly through drafting/training.
Again, an exaggeration. We are not affecting the prices in such an order that would completely annihilate trading. I do like the change of tone though, we are all on the same side here.

I have considered your whole post, and there are three points (above) that I would like to address. (1) I understand now that training is at the apex of this game. (2) Managers utilizing many different approaches, each with an equal chance of success if they do it equally skillfully, would seem ideal to me, rather than favoring one to the exclusion of others. (3) We'll see if the market is balanced. My perception as manager of a lower- and mid-level team was that the market already favored training over transfer by a wide margin, and the recent change has further imbalanced it. We'll see.
(1) True. (2) A balance between these types of managers is exactly what we're trying to achieve. Details of that balance have been explained above. (3) This is, of course, an opinion from your standpoint and as such it is valued. Global statistics are a whole different game. I agree that we need time to see where this leads us.

(36177757)...did you think that 18 years old will be not saved from free agency?
I hate to repeat myself, but FA is not meant to save every valuable player. Read my previous posts and the rest of the text above to explain why, please. This one did not make the cut and that is not a bug.

Tbh. I think we have reached a point, where the current system will remain in place just because and will be overthrown/changed in a couple months with the argument that the goals have been reached/everything is different now.

Its a bit sad that we are stuck in trench warfare and that easy adjustments cannot be intorduced because it would feel like a personal defeat. So dear Marin, please reevaluate the free agents and tweak it a little bit, so more users are happy with it.
Adjustments will be made when and where we decide based on the assessed situation. If you think I don't make changes in BB every day because I'm stubborn, you're wrong. Changes are rarely implemented mid season because the effects of these changes need to be properly checked and doing that when you're changing other things that affect them makes it impossible. Also, I'm not here to implement popular changes, I'm here to do what's best for the game in the long run. I'm sure I already said that before. Otherwise this game would quickly decend from being challenging to being super easy. I doubt you'd like that very much. We do value our users opinions but this is not a democracy.

I wonder how can someone say that the new FA system is good or bad when WE DON'T KNOW WHAT CHANGED?
BB must have a world record or something of not letting its users know the rules (!!!) of the game.
Disrespectful, at least.
So, now you may continue to debate based on speculation. Don't forget to find out the rules on your own.
There are many things in BB that have not been disclosed but our users had to figure out on their own. This is not unintentional, a big part of the game is figuring out how something works. Some enjoy this process, others prefer to just have everything handed to them. I don't feel this is disrespectful at all.

Honestly I think the rules are particularly punitive for a couple positions, one being C like this player. It is quite clear if you also look at 21-25yo players who are retiring.
The switch from salary to TSP definitely favors the SF position, followed by PG and SG, then PF and finally C. Read above for a more elaborate explanation.

Last edited by BB-Marin at 6/4/2015 7:51:32 AM

This Post:
00
270734.101 in reply to 270734.98
Date: 6/4/2015 2:45:16 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
370370
Looking for areas of agreement ...
There needs to be a balance between these manager types [traders and trainers]
Totally agree! This is great news!

Oops!
This is the main reason why training should be more important than trading... So, do we like high TL prices? Yes, they directly motivate training.
I guess we don't agree after all ... ???

Here is a good target to aim for:
There needs to be a balance between these manager types...
Hopefully by trying my best to find areas of agreement I can continue to be able to offer input. Thanks, Marin.

This Post:
00
270734.102 in reply to 270734.84
Date: 6/5/2015 2:17:11 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
370370
What we know is that high salary/high potential young players (21-25yo) are retiring, while they wouldn't have in the previous system.

There is the nucleus of the problem. And the News never even hinted at that.

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